Up grade GS1000 Generator stator windings

[Havoc]

I borrowed an alternator winding off Andrew up in Crieff so we could finish our trip round the NC500. I need to send it back and was wondering if, in the last 40 years, there is an upgraded winding that I could install?

I thank you

Edited August 19, 2021 by Havoc

[Wolf]

I have twice had to resolder the wires from windings to R&R and still have a steady charge rate of 12.7-13.8v 

[Swiss Toni]

1 hour ago, Havoc said:

I borrowed an alternator winding off Andrew up in Crieff so we could finish our trip round the NC500. I need to send it back and was wondering if, in the last 40 years, there is an upgraded winding that I could install?

I thank you

Rex’s Speed Shop. 01580 880768

[gs7_11]

The original spec is adequate output and last 40+ years. What more do you want? 

Just fit a new one. Rex's or Electrex.

[wraith]

Did hear someone say one of the latter gsxr ones can be made to fit.

But I'd just keep it simple and get a new one of the above, no hassles just plug and play.

[Gixer1460]

8 minutes ago, wraith said:

Did hear someone say one of the latter gsxr ones can be made to fit.

With a shed load of work - Arttu did it on his EFE - wanted better output due to having EFI electronics and pump to run.

[Rijko]

Why would you want to upgrade ?

If the reason is to escape fried igniter ("CDI"), stator, regulator and rectifier : if wiring loom is OK (hardly any is, after decades of neglect and corrosion. Measure and be shocked about 'missing volts'), and engine oil level is topped off religiously, the oldfashioned original system will work fine.

In that case, use as much power as possible while riding : always use the headlight, do not upgrade to LED.

A popular upgrade is to replace the R/R ( most use the SH-775 ) which works very different so components are less stressed.

See TGSR-Stator Papers (thegsresources.com)

Many threads on GSR on this well-known issue.

 

 

Edited August 23, 2021 by Rijko

[rodneya]

42 minutes ago, Rijko said:

Why would you want to upgrade ?

If the reason is to escape fried igniter ("CDI"), stator, regulator and rectifier : if wiring loom is OK (hardly any is, after decades of neglect and corrosion. Measure and be shocked about 'missing volts'), and engine oil level is topped off religiously, the oldfashioned original system will work fine.

In that case, use as much power as possible while riding : always use the headlight, do not upgrade to LED.

A popular upgrade is to replace the R/R ( most use the SH-775 ) which works very different so components are less stressed.

See TGSR-Stator Papers (thegsresources.com)

Many threads on GSR on this well-known issue.

Why do you say to always use the headlight? Is it because one of the stator power wires goes directly to the headlight?

42 minutes ago, Rijko said:

 

 

 

[Rijko]

Oversimplified, but :

the older GS bikes had a separate rectifier and regulator, later (1980+) ones were combined R/R.

Both had the same disadvantage : simply put the stator has to deliver max capacity.

The power generated goes into the R/R, powers the bike, but with the battery fully charged the surplus has to go somewhere.

This surplus turns into heat and taxes the stator, regulator and rectifier heavily.

(the wiring loom with corroded connections everywhere and corrosion in handlebar switches etc make this issue even bigger))

Topping off the oil to max at least helps the stator get rid of some heat.

Driving with the 50W headlamp and smaller rear light consumes some of the amps and relieves some heat stress on these parts.

The Shindengen SH-775 R/R, CompuFire and alike work on a different principle, it asks for what it needs, no more.

That is much easier on those components.

 

Edited August 23, 2021 by Rijko

[Rijko]

Just for giggles, measure the voltage on your coils, or on the (usually) green/yellow wire that activates the starter relais.

Or any other easily accessible 12V wire on the bike.

99,9% chance you'll be surprised by the voltage on the battery compared to what you measure there.

Hence my 'missing volts' remark.

Lower voltage means bad connections ; which in turn means higher than designed amperage and heat in those wires.

The transparent bullet connector cover turned brown is also a good indicator for a bad connection generating heat.

Edited August 23, 2021 by Rijko

[Rijko]

oh .. that leads to the 'coil relay mod'.

Basically in the situation you measure low voltage on your coils, always due to bad connections, you can use a relais to work off that bad low-voltage connection. The relais taps fresh 12V off the battery and feeds it to the coils.

While some have reported no further issues, imho it's a bad approach : it's ignoring a wiring loom that has issues.

A quick, short-term-effective, but bad workaround for a bigger problem - all it does is allow the underlying issue to grow until some other component dies.

Measure voltage, resistance, and meticulously clean each connection in the wiring loom is the only way to solve this.

My opinion, don't shoot me guys

Edited August 23, 2021 by Rijko

[TonyGee]

nothing wrong with giving good advice about cleaning all the contacts. you wont get shot for that   

[Gixer1460]

Essentially what you are saying is a 40+yr old designed loom and been used for 40+yrs isn't really fit for purpose anymore - a rewired loom would be a far better proposition! Nothing wrong with that just not achievable for most unless electrickery inclined. Even trying to clean old connectors just reveals more corrosion and the dreaded 'black' oxidised or 'Green' corroded wire when stripping back insulation to make a new connection. Sometimes enough is enough and re-new is the way forward. And btw those Series R/R are bloody expensive - almost cheaper to get a new rewound stator and shunt R/R and keep up with regular oil changes!

[Rijko]

Correct

Agreed on the complexity and cost of replacing wiring (and handlebar switches, contact, R/R, all that has old wiring or connectors).

Too bad new looms are rare as hen's teeth.

So for most, the only option will be to repair/recondition the existing stuff best they can, or have it done.

BTW, on GSR is a member that buys, tests, and sells 2nd hand series SH-775 R/R quite cheap.

Edited August 24, 2021 by Rijko

[Rijko]

LOL autocorrect works funny on you G I X E R .... if i type "C o r r e c t G i x e r"  without the spaces i get this after submit :

Correct say what now!?

Edited August 24, 2021 by Rijko

[Gixer1460]

The site doesn't like the bastardisation of GSXR - they are funny lot round here LOL!

[vizman]

Not as much as I don’t like that fuck Coles pronunciation version ‘jeezer’

[coombehouse]

I don't know if the gs1000 & early gsx1100 flywheel & starter clutch are similar, but this may be helpful. Gsxr600 k6 flywheel & stator.

https://oldskoolsuzuki.info/forums/topic/617-et-flywheel-alternatives/

[hannibal]

On 8/23/2021 at 10:42 AM, rodneya said:

Why do you say to always use the headlight? Is it because one of the stator power wires goes directly to the headlight?

 

On the second question, yes for the earlier bikes. The stator has three outputs. Two run directly to the R/R. The third output runs to the headlight switch. When the light is switched on, the third leg is then connected to the R/R. This was done to try to match electrical load to stator output.

A common solution is to remove the headlight loop of the third leg and send all stator outputs ditectly to the R/R. The second piece is to also replace the R/R with an SH775. You can find new ones for $100 or used ones for under $50 bucks on Eblag. Just make sure it says SH775 on the R/R as there are a lot of fakes. 

The SH775 was original equipment on some Polaris, SeaDoo/SkiDoo, and Harley models. I try to grab them when I see them at a good price. I test them on my GS750 and put them in the spare parts bin. I have a genuine used SH775 to sell if you're interested. I'm in Maryland USA.

Also, Triumph makes a plug in harness for the SH775. The Triumph R/R is not an SH775, but shares the same plugs. Got my Triumph harness for about $10 for a local dealer. 

The GS750 and smaller motors use a 12 pole stator and rotor while the GS1000 (and larger motors?) use an 18 pole stator and rotor. You can't use an 18 pole stator with a 12 pole rotor or vice versa. I've heard good things about Electrosport rotors but haven't used one. My GS750 came with an 18 pole stator and rotor and it's been perfectly fine with the SH775.

Edited August 25, 2021 by hannibal

[Reinhoud]

On 8/20/2021 at 7:28 AM, Havoc said:

I borrowed an alternator winding off Andrew up in Crieff so we could finish our trip round the NC500. I need to send it back and was wondering if, in the last 40 years, there is an upgraded winding that I could install?

I thank you

I have something upgraded, at least the salesman said so, but I don't have a clue where I got it from..

[imago]

On 8/24/2021 at 9:16 AM, Gixer1460 said:

 And btw those Series R/R are bloody expensive - almost cheaper to get a new rewound stator and shunt R/R and keep up with regular oil changes!

It's all relative I suppose, but £120 (ish) doesn't seem that expensive? Certainly cheaper than getting a rewind.

Here for example, and it even comes with marinised connectors.