turbo/EFI setup

[Captain Chaos]

What is the setup you are using? @Scara had the great idea of making some database of members' EFI configurations.

Specifically as follows:

Engine Management System - type

Ignition system: Type

Throttle bodies: - Which model and mods performed.

Injector sizes: Primary and Secondary if applicable.

Std Coils or Pencil stick coils (type / part number / model) - etc

Fuel pressure at pump: What type of pump being used (factory OEM Suzuki pump tank mounted as an example)

You get the idea, perhaps if its good enough, we can make it a sticky somewhere on the forum.

Edited October 18, 2015 by captain chaos

[Arttu]

Ok, let's start. My GSX1100E '83. 1230cc, 9:1 compression ratio, IHI VF34 ball bearing turbo, water injection for charge cooling.

Engine Management: Megasquirt 3 based ECU, additional data logging by CAN bus IO Expander from Autotune.fi (EGT for each cylinder, wheel speed, acceleration etc.)

Ignition system: Sequential Coil-On-Plug, inductive, controlled by the ECU.

Throttle bodies: GSX-R600 2001 (38mm). Secondary butterflies removed, modified spacing, cable mechanism moved in the middle of the rack.

Injectors: Primary - GSX-R600, 280cc, Keihin. Secondary - 630cc Siemens Deka, on the back side of the plenum.

Ignition coils: Bosch 986221016 equivalent (Porsche 911 turbo etc.), home made ignition amplifier.

Fuel system: Walbro GSL392 pump (255l/h), Mallory pressure regulator, 2.5 bar base pressure (lower pressure to reduce current draw of the pump)

 

Here are a couple of dyno graphs. Black one was on 1.1 bar boost, blue one about 1.3 bar.

 

[slingy1157]

Wow, very impressive figures Arttu. 320BHP is awesome figures from a gsx based motor. 

You must be well happy with that 

[JK1]

GSXR 1216, compression n/a, Holset HX35 super, Devils Own water injection. http://i1229.photobucket.com/albums/ee467/mju0288/tehokartta.jpg

 

Engine Management System - Tatech  T32pro http://tatech.fi/index.php?id=specifications

Ignition system: Ecu + Trigger system made by Arttu

Throttle bodies: GSXR K2

Injector sizes:  Bosch 1000cc

Std Coils or Pencil stick coils (type / part number / model) - d585 coils, not sure which brand  http://roguetuning.com/D585_coil.jpg

Fuel pressure at pump: What type of pump being used (factory OEM Suzuki pump tank mounted as an example): In tank, modified suzuki parts with Walbro 255 pump, external  Aeromotive pressure regulator

 

J

[Arttu]

Wow, very impressive figures Arttu. 320BHP is awesome figures from a gsx based motor. 

You must be well happy with that 

Thanks! It's pretty nice indeed. However, the turbo and engine should be capable fore some more, let's see if I bother to crank up the boost and dyno it again at some point

[Arttu]

And then another example. Not my bike but I updated the engine management and tuned the engine for it earlier this year. GSX-R1100 "slingy", don't know exact year. 1168cc, compression unknown, TD04-16 turbo, intercooler.

Engine Management: Megasquirt 2 based, my own "bike edition".

Ignition: wasted spark, controlled by the ECU.

Throttle bodies: GSX-R1000, don't know which year. Secondary butterflies removed, spacing modified.

Injectors: GSX-R1000, 310cc/min at increased fuel pressure, probably 280cc/min at standard 3 bar pressure.

Ignition coils: Audi stick coils with integrated drivers.

Fuel system: Some external Walbro pump, Malpassi regulator, base pressure 4 bar (increased to get more flow from the injectors).

 

Here is a dyno graph on 0.5 bar boost. That was maximum what the injectors were capable for.

 

 

[Scara]

Cheers for the submissions thus far gents. Keep em coming guys

[TiZiK]

For mine, I have a Slabby 1100. I have a spare engine that's getting a 1316 cranknup build and a bone stock complete bike. I used the stocker to set up my efi. 

ECU - Microsquirt V3 with wideband O2

Ignition - 36-1 trigger wheel, Quadspark module using 2012 GSXR 1000 Stick coils

Fuel - 2003 GSXR 600 throttle bodies. Secondary butterflies removed and holes epoxied up and spaced in the center (appx 10mm) to fit. Seimens DEKA 4s short stalk 60lb/hr injectors. Bosch 044 fuel pump. AEM fuel pressure regulator with 43psi baseline pressure. 

So far, all's good on the stock motor. Got a decent baseline tune in. Starts easily and has good throttle response. Almost finished the bigbore engine. Once done, I'll swap it into the chassis and tune further. The efi swap was quite easy actually. 

[coombehouse]

Bike is normally aspirated GSX1100 Kat with 1290 cosworth kit, G3 cams, Upperton head etc. main reason for the EFI was I couldnt handle the heavy throttle with 38mm flat slides. Broken wrists cant cope any more & it was a good opportunity to play with something.

Total cost will be about the same as a new set of flatslides (£700) provided you can think laterally & do the fab & machining yourself. You will also need to buy or borrow a wideband lambda sensor & controller & a laptop to set it all up. Its addictive & I am about to do another bike though its not a Suzuki!

Engine Management System - Microsquirt V3

Ignition system: Microsquirt with Bosch amplifier from a Peugeot car & 36-1 2 inch wheel from Triggerwheels.com. They are the cheapest I have found for the Microsquirt too. One standard GSX1100 ignition pickup repositioned on custom mounting plate.

Throttle bodies:  - GSXR600k1 to k3 respaced with linkage moved to centre (copied from Arttu). Ramair sock filters. Throttle bodies soon to be replaced by GSXR750Y to K3 model respaced etc. Can be bought for £50 or less if you are lucky.

Injector sizes: What the GSXR  bodies came with.

Std Coils or Pencil stick: Green Dyna coils

Fuel pressure at pump: Sytec external pump & pressure regulator off Eblag. Standard 43psi as per GSXR. Current limiting box of tricks from Arttu to reduce current drain when the bike is running slowly. 

Temperature sensors & MAP sensor from Radio spares

Plugs & fuse box from Vehicle Wiring Products or anywhere similar.

[busa ash]

I have been watching this section for inspirational knowledge , my old skool build requires new skool fueling collecting parts still before I make my move

[Screwriverracing]

Hi all,

what ecu's are there and what's the prices, motec m 84 £1600 ,dta, OMEX, microsquirt, obviously need to be suitable for a bike.

will propaly need to change mine but funds are limited.

Cheers SRR

[Gixer1460]

If I had to look around, i'd seriously consider the MS3 Pro - does sequential everything, as clever as most out there, small / compact, is COMPLETELY waterproof and is competitively priced - perfect for bike application and the associated tuning / data analysis software isn't bad either.

Edit - Seller has revised waterproof to 'splashproof' but unit can be immersed in few inches of water for a few minutes - I read that as pretty waterproof in most cases of use!

Edited April 16, 2016 by Gixer1460
correct reference

[slingy1157]

Depends entirely what features you want? No use paying for a host of fancy features if you dont need them 

List all the features  you really want to have it able to do, then look for an ecu that fits the bill for the money you want to spend.

Like sequential, its great but in reality, makes little difference to anything for the amount of extra work and dyno time to fine tune. The only reason i would sequential is for the spark so you can go COP's and get the full 2 crank rotations of coil charge time, BUT, the fact that bikes, and Carby turbo bikes have been running the old wasted spark without issue for decades, makes me doudt if even that is worth it really. COPS are worth it though even if running wasted spark control so if one plug shits itself it dosnt effect the paired cylinder like a normal dual saprk coil would.

I would still vote microsquirt but thats what i'm used to, does everything + a few extras and is cheap and compact. The software in Tunerstudio is excellant! You can configure everything yourself, update firmware, calibrate any sensors you want to use or just use listed sensors provided in menus . And the Alpha-n with multiply MAP function (fuel table uses TPS with MAP sensor reading calculated on top to come up with the injector pulse) works perfect for turbobikes.

 Others hate them, they can be temperamental, (just see the issues Danm54 had) but its nearly always because the settings are wrong, or the wrong firmware has been used or something the user has done to it. But its always the ECU's fault lol. Anyway, what ever suits your needs i suppose, theres lots of good ecu's out there know to choose from.

[slingy1157]

Original System, Turbo Shortstroke GSXR 750 running a IHI RHB5 turbo off a Fiat Uno.

Microsquirt V2 ECU with internal ignition drivers

GPZ1100 34mm TB's and TPS (direct fit on GSXR)

550cc Mazda RX7 Denso high impedance injectors (Direct fit into the TB's)

Home made fuel rail to suit above

Pierburg external pump

SARD adjsutable FPR

Copy GM 3bar MAP sensor

GM coolant sensor

GPZ750 turbo IAT sensor and plenum

Ford EDIS 4 post coil

50mm 36-1 Triggerwheels,com crank wheel with stock pickup on stock plate.

Innovate wide band sensor wired into ECU

System runs batch injection and wasted spark so no need for cam sensor for sequential.

Initally run with Speed Density (MAP ) Load control, then upgraded firmware to Extracode, which allowed the change to Apha-N with MAP Multiplication for load control.

Speed Density for Ignition load control.

All road and kitchen table tuned. 

It ran great but not great power. NA dyno was 81hp and 40ftlbs' on the carbs. Dyno below on about 10psi i think

 

 

[wombat258]

GSXR1100W in a race car. 1118cc, 9:1 compression ratio, Hahn 16G turbo (Mitsubishi) with internal wastegate and Kinugawa actuator, 30cm x 30cm x 10cm intercooler. Oil scavenge by pimp pump driven off water pump. Electric water pump (EBP x 2) by Davies Craig.

Engine Management: Microsquirt V3 based ECU running fuel only

Ignition system: Dyna 2000 programmable ignition with pressure switch for boost retard. 2 bar MAP sensor. Tech Edge WBO2 controller.

Throttle bodies: Hilborn/Kinsler (46mm).

Injectors: 52lb Delphi.

Ignition coils: Dyna green coils.

Fuel system: Facet cube pump feeding swirl pot for Bosch 979 pump, Bosch 3 bar pressure regulator

Upgraded alternator to 40 amp output (Triumph) to handle electrical loads at low rpm.

Edited February 20, 2017 by wombat258
Needed larger injectors!

[Scara]

GSXR 1100 J running 1109 Wiseco forged pistons.

Proflow port and polished Cylinder head - balanced crank

Yoshimura ST2 cams and double springs - Kibble White exhaust valves - APE intake valves.

Mitsubishi TD05 16G Turbo with 11 psi external wastegate and drain tank.

Oil Scavenger pump by Dr. Boost and Davies Craig 7" Thermo fan for oil cooling

Ignition System: Dyna 2000 programmable ignition currently set at 4' retard.

Ignition Coils: GSXR600 shorty pencil coils 1.2 ohm units - system requires a full 12.5 - 13.1v charge to start bike.

Fuel System: Walbro 255lt pump and Malpassi fully adjustable FPR set at 3.5 psi

Fueling: BST 34 SS CV Carbs with 42.5 pilots and #95 Main jets giving a perfect AR balance.

Innovate AR Gauge - Greddy boost - 2 batteries - 2 fuse boxes for all the necessary crap connected.

Workshop tune and road tested only - Barrel Roll to come.

 

[skelly]

Ok so far...

I have a 1000 kat with an 1170 wiseco kit.

Welded crank.

Efe flowed head.

STD EFE cams & valves (for now)

MCT.

Kawa GPZ1100 throttle bodies with GSX1400 high impedance (15 ohm) injectors.

Fuel rail drilled to suit.

Dyna 2.2 ohm twin output coils.

Was going for a DTA S40 ECU but I'm now looking at microsquirt with external coil driver as long as I can make sure that the microsquirt will drive a kat rev counter.

Heres the link to my build if anyone is interested.

Cheers.

Skel.

[Cluffy]

So what's the optimum compression ratio for a gsxr 1052 with possible big bore and low comp pistons? I thought approx 9:1 ??

[no class]

any thoughts or experiences with newer gsxr 600 throttle bodies (8 injector type) ?  

[Arttu]

6 hours ago, no class said:

any thoughts or experiences with newer gsxr 600 throttle bodies (8 injector type) ?  

GSX-R600 06-07 seem to fit quite nicely on oil cooled engines with later model Bandit intake boots. I'm installing a set at the moment. I also have a hunch that secondary injectors on those might be quite big so they could be capable for some real power with stock injectors. I'll try to find time to measure them on next few weeks. I will keep you updated.

[gmansyz]

Okay, I too have a set of these GSXR 600 throttle bodies. For sale as I will not use them.

But what I was thinking is maybe we need a column listing all the fuel injectors and their flow rates?

Would help us deciding on which to source and if any of the stock injectors are worth using or hoarding.

G

[gmansyz]

Arttu, I am suspecting that the secondary injectors may flow less than the primaries. After all, they were for the 600/750. Plus, the secondaries are shorter.

Note, the secondaries should actually be pointed straight into the throttle bodies throat. Not the now missing second throttle plate. The new GSXR 1000 is like this and countless Gurls blouse's.

G

[gmansyz]

Sorry, I was trying to say countless Gurls blouse's.

G

[gmansyz]

Sumpthing is up with autocorrect.

[gmansyz]

Sorry, I was trying to say countless Gurls blouse's.

Like the 2004 and newer CBR 1000 RR and more.

G