GSXR1100M Engine into Blandit

[Roger P.]

Anything unusual to make this a difficult swap? Blew up my 1200 motor bigtime. I have sourced an 1100M motor for ok-ish money, but need to know if there is any complications to getting it to work. If I swap out the sump and oil intake, can I reuse my aftermarket pipe (Black Widow header + Yosh RS-3). If the motor is sound, how much power do you think it would make with RS-38's and open pipe + filters?

[Rene EFE]

Swap is as straightforward as you say. Power could be up from the Bandit, but these old engines can be a bit hit and miss. 

[Oilyspanner]

As Rene - a fresh engine with good piston ring sealing, good sealing valves etc should be good for around 140 hp, a used engine with unknown history ? something less than that.. do the valve clearances, people often don't like doing the shim heads as often, it's easier to do the screw and lock nut ones. If it's a good engine you should be pleased with the result, especially the second half of the rev range... good luck - Oily

[Swirl]

Maybe better off with the mid range torque of powerscreen motor, depending on what your after

[wraith]

Don't think the gsxr motor will rev as high with the b12 cdi, it will run ok but I believe the rev limited lower on the b12 than in the gsxr.

[Roger P.]

Rev limit is currently pretty low ffs..

Sweated bullets all last weekend getting it back together. Ran like a streak of shit through a tin whistle with the 750 cams and dot head, then a massive smoke show. Something went in cylinder 4 and holed the cases. Snakebit project from start to finish. I'm probably just going to sell it on with the replacement motor, just a massive pissoff looking at it now.

 

[Gixer1460]

Hmmmm at a guess - a rod cap / bolt failed? 

Normally its the little end / mid rod that snaps and cuts its way out via the barrels & block!

[wraith]

I did the same, but with a gsxr1100 (1052cc)  so I know how you feel. 

[Roger P.]

Well, being a glutton for punishment, I bought a secondhand GSXR 1127 motor off a guy whose basement looked like the holy of holies of slabbie worhip. About 6 complete slabbie 750's and 1100s of museum quality, with another pristine 1100 in the garage for day to day, alongside the skeleton a another 750 slabbie. Motors all over the place.I figured I'd forgo the Eblag experience and take my chances that this was a useable engine. They are not easy to find around here.

 

Now, before anyone gets on me for fucking up the most basic dot-head conversion, let me say that upon further inspection, #4 piston is largely AWOL. I can move the con rod back and forth like a bell knocker with no sign of any piston to be found anywhere. Lovely grooves up both sides of the liner from the wristpin, which is still snugly in place. Haven't a fucking clue what happened, but the dot-head conversion does not seem to have been the problem. The engine held 70mph quite easily even trailing a huge cloud of smoke. Yes, I was extremely pissed off at the time and just wanted to get home....

 

Curiously, my blown up engine has a V720 engine code, which indicates its a 2006 motor, but the bike is a 2004, so it's not the first time this engine has been swapped. Sad to see that masterpiece of a motor reduced to bits, but that's life. 

 

Anyhow, I'm torn as to whether I just slap in the new motor and sell it on, or turn it into a winter project and build a proper 1216. The main advantage of a Bandit is the (relatively) cheap insurance rates in Ontario. I was looking at a ZX12R and got quotes for $5000/yr for basic liability. 

 

What I'd like to know is, can I install my old Bandit 1200 head without a loss of compression. It is a known quantity, and would let me reuse the 750J cams I bought. It would also eliminate the shim valve adjustments.

[jonny1bump]

Why don't you just stick the complete 1127 motor in as complete package untouched and try it?

Edited August 7, 2018 by jonny1bump

[Roger P.]

This certainly appeals to my lazy side,  but there's a fair bit of oily mess on the front which leads me to think I'd be pulling it again to fix leaks. Still, I guess I need to find them,  and pulling the motor from a Bandit isn't the hardest job in the world, so it's probably not a bad idea. I guess I'm just not feeling lucky atm. Seems like I'd wind up in one of those click bait ads "This man just fitted a 1100M engine onto his Bandit. What happens next will make you cry laughing!"

Edited August 8, 2018 by Roger P.

[Dezza]

Are the sumps the same on the M and the Blandit12? If not, you may have to put the Blandit sump onto the M engine to fit the Blandit exhaust. Also, doesn't the blandit 12 have a resistor in the ignition switch that works with the blandit CDI? If the CDI is changed for the M unit, then wouldn't the switch have to be changed/modifed?

[Gixer1460]

The sumps are deffo different - GSXR 4-2-2 exhaust, Blandit 4-1 ............... collectors around or under sump. Don't forget pick-ups to match sump.

[Roger P.]

Well, couldn't leave well enough alone and pulled the head and block off the donor motor. Plenty of carbon on the piston crowns and hard glassy burnt oil on the exhaust valve stems, so it looks like this engine is an oil burner. Not surprising given the age and unknown provenance I suppose. New rings and head gasket on order, but I'm not convinced this will keep it from being a smoker. As usual, two very low mileage Blandits have  instantly appeared in the local classifieds for about what the gasket and rings + motor are costing me, so yay for me!

The motor is older than I thought and has the rocker head.

Useless trivia: The cams have the same B and G stamps on the inlet and exhaust cams that I pulled out of an '89  750 a few years ago.

I will be installing my good Bandit head with 50K on it to take care of any valve stem and seal issues. It is much cleaner than the GSXR head.

The cams are in slightly poorer shape then the 750 cams I picked up a few years ago (mild scuffing and pitting). They will be sold on cheapish.

 

Edited August 26, 2018 by Roger P.

[Roger P.]

Look closely, and you will find two valve heads. Piston #4 seems to have had a major disagreement with both of them.

[Blubber]

Ouch...Is this after you installed the Bandit head?

[Roger P.]

No. This is the carnage after my one and only ride with the dot head and 750 cams.

My new rings and head gasket have arrived so hopefully reassembly of my 1100 motor will be underway shortly.

I thought getting this 1200 motor out of the frame would be a doddle, but damn was it a fight, even with the downtube off.

once I get everything back in place, I'll finish tearing down this motor and see if it's worth building up over the winter.

 

 

 

[Dezza]

Do you have the chunk of case that has been knocked out? It's amazing what case damage can be repaired by someone who really knows their stuff.

[Roger P.]

Sadly, no. It's out in the wilderness somewhere. Might be a good project for the crusty 1%er welder guy who welded up the holes left in my Bandit head when I drilled out the broken studs. He's worked his magic on some broken carb float posts for a few guys.

[Roger P.]

Heh, heh, heh......yeahhhhhhhh.....

Edited September 6, 2018 by Roger P.

[Roger P.]

It would seem the "bolt on the dot head and 750K cams route to more power" did not work for me....

 

Cam timing was spot on.No indication that the head had been skimmed or my engine had ever been opened. No fucking idea what happened. The surviving pistons show exhaust valve contact. $500 worth of new exhaust valves gone there.

Scary part is I had been 260km/h just minutes earlier.

Be warned!

 

Edited September 6, 2018 by Roger P.

[Gixer1460]

Well that ain't gonna hone or polish out! Std valves are good but they do have an annoying habit of dropping their heads if they get overly hot - something else to check!

[Askamaskinservice]

2 hours ago, Roger P. said:

Heh, heh, heh......yeahhhhhhhh.....

Ouch, 6 valves and 2 pistons missing.

Infinite crankcaseventilaton, this is a blown engine at it's best.

I feel for you.

260km/h,  don't go buy a lotteryticket.

Better luck with next build.

[Hasselstad]

Hi.. I juse a bandit 12 with cams from gsxr, and 1216 priston. Keihin 40mm. Cdi from gsxr. And cooling must be in 2 step.. The top must have cooling is selv, The Oli line back on The cylinder, must have a littel cooler... In The front.. Have The same problem ones.. No problem now.. 163 ph.. Top flow head. Mjp denmark.. In a sidecar f1.. Best redg Peter.. 

[Hasselstad]

If you want.. Call at.+45 50150707.. Peter