Metralla Posted January 21, 2023 Share Posted January 21, 2023 Hello I have a 1052 and I want to optimise it with the following restrictions: Bottom end and pistons will stay OEM. (it has 10.000 miles from new!) I want the airbox. What I want to understand is: What carburettors can be used? Can I use B12Mk1 BST36? What rubbers (front and rear) do I need for that? Keep in mind I want the airbox. Will the FactoryPro carburettor kits make any difference? Will I need rejetting for the Hindle exhaust? Will I benefit from skimming and porting the head? Will I benefit from larger vavles? Keep in mind it is a road bike, so I highly value midrange. What are the best cams for that? Or what is the very next performance level for the cams after the OEM cams? Is it better to use DOT head or skimming the 1052 head will be ok? As I said I want a bike close to the original specs, but optimised, I do not want mechanical carbs, big bore etc. If I get 130RWHP with strong midrange I will be very happy. Also any engine builder in UK that can do the headwork? Quote Link to comment
baldrick Posted January 21, 2023 Share Posted January 21, 2023 i am not certain but i doubt the bandit carbs would fit the std airbox, so i would go with a set of mikuni rs36 flatslide carbs, a decent exhaust, like the hindle, and a good flow/port of the head to let it breath. the cams wont make a hugely noticable difference for the money, but if you insist, go with a set of kent "fast road" profile cams. i wouldnt bother skimming the head or bigger valves, the returns are minimal compared to the cost 1 Quote Link to comment
george 1100 Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 38mm flatslides Basic port job focusing on cleaning up the bowls, short turn and blend and port match 80mm 12:1 pistons instead of spending on cams Slotted cam sprockets No need to skim anything That should comfortably bump you over 130hp. Unless you are chasing big numbers, don't waste you're time with big valves and dot heads imo 1 Quote Link to comment
Dezza Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 If you fit a dot head, the carbs will sit higher and at a raised angle than before. This will mean, if whatever carbs you use fit in the frame and under the tank, the stock airbox will not fit. Quote Link to comment
Captain Chaos Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 11 hours ago, baldrick said: i would go with a set of mikuni rs36 flatslide carbs 1 hour ago, george 1100 said: 38mm flatslides OP wants CV carbs 12 hours ago, Metralla said: I do not want mechanical carbs 1 Quote Link to comment
wraith Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 If you want to keep the standard airbox you are restricted to what carbs and the power they will give you. Stick to the standard carbs, as you are wanting to stay with the Standard bore as well, the only real gains you're going to get is to put a good Fred flowing exhaust system on have the head flowed/ported and some Dyno time. That's the best you will get with the restrictions you're putting on the bike, you'd be very lucky to get anywhere near 130bhp rw you might get 120bhp rw if you're very lucky but be prepared for much less. 2 Quote Link to comment
Dezza Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 The 38mm BSTs from a GSXR750 L,M are likely to give a power increase with a decent exhaust system but will need the 750 rubbers to go on and also won't fit with the stock airbox. They're also tall carbs and may cause clearance issues in a stock slabby frame (?????), and aren't exactly easy to get hold of (carbs and rubbers). Overall, I agree that the easiest way forward is to fit a set of RS 36,38. They'll also be much easier to set up than a set of CV carbs. 1 Quote Link to comment
DAZ Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 (edited) 1, keep your 34mm carbs ,if 36mm will handle 150 bhp I reckon 34's will cope with 130.no issues matching up with the air box and on my bandits we drilled the air box for more flow 2,hindle exhaust is good 3, dyno jet kit is ok IF you won't dyno tune your bike as their jets are different to std sizes ie dyno jet 125 is not the same as mikuni 125 not sure about factory pro kits 4, get your cam sprockets slotted and degree the cams properly 5, be honest about how much power you really need and how you ride ,personally I've slowed down and with the amount of speed cameras,unmarked cars, Dudley Doo-rights with dash cams I might have a mad 5 minutes but a lot of the time I'm fairly steady , if your not then big power is out there if you've got the need and the pocket depth ..... I reckon 110-120 depending on the happiness of the dyno Edited January 22, 2023 by DAZ Addition 2 Quote Link to comment
Metralla Posted January 22, 2023 Author Share Posted January 22, 2023 Thanks for all the replies! So... No DOT head. BST34s and stock airbox. FactoryPro jet kit that might need rejet, I have a jet gauge to compare them with Mikunis. I had bad experience from DynoJet, they worn badly after 12.000 miles. Hindle exhaust. Fast road cams and I will add adjustable sprockets. Kent cams or Web cams? Are Kents exchange only? I will put an ignition advancer. Benefits of porting? Benefits of skimming? I would immagine higer compression would be really noticable midrange. Benefits of big valves? Money is not an issue, unitl they become an issue --> I need tuner recommendations in order to get a quote for headwork labour cost. 130RWHP depends a lot on the dyno, on the dyno I am talking about, a Stock 1052 made 115RWHP a tad less than a stock GSXR750K6 (118RWHP). The figure is totally indicative, If the bike is smooth and feels faster across the rev range. Quote Link to comment
wraith Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 9 minutes ago, Metralla said: Thanks for all the replies! So... No DOT head. BST34s and stock airbox. FactoryPro jet kit that might need rejet, I have a jet gauge to compare them with Mikunis. I had bad experience from DynoJet, they worn badly after 12.000 miles. Hindle exhaust. Fast road cams and I will add adjustable sprockets. Kent cams or Web cams? Are Kents exchange only? I will put an ignition advancer. Benefits of porting? Benefits of skimming? I would immagine higer compression would be really noticable midrange. Benefits of big valves? Money is not an issue, unitl they become an issue --> I need tuner recommendations in order to get a quote for headwork labour cost. 130RWHP depends a lot on the dyno, on the dyno I am talking about, a Stock 1052 made 115RWHP a tad less than a stock GSXR750K6 (118RWHP). The figure is totally indicative, If the bike is smooth and feels faster across the rev range. Skimming the head, will give you a bit more toque but not a huge amount. Bigger valves, no point with standard bores, if anything will be a step backwards. Porting, yes. Will help the gas flow better and will probably give the best result, apart from exhaust. Cams, down to you, some like one make some like the other. As the the gsxr1100 ghj and only having APX 115 rwbh compared to 118 rwbh on a gsxr750k6. The bikes are a world apart and you can't compare them. It's like saying why don't my old xr2 fiesta go as fast as a new ST. It's just a fact old stuff (without doing a lot of work ) is just slower, sorry. 1 Quote Link to comment
DAZ Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 (edited) Kent cams are generally exchange,or they will charge you a surcharge for outright Ignition advancer if you are dyno tuning try with and without ,esp if you have head skimmed Porting will add power but for what you are after a general clean up of the ports and bowl area would be all , big ports can loose "crispness" in the midrange from what I've been told, to do with port velocity I've no personal experience of this others who have may tell you different Big valves big power at mid to top ,a set of oversize kibblewhite valve is about £800 from suzuki performance spares + machining + porting to suit and then stock carbs won't keep up.... Oh and add 2/3 teeth to the rear sprocket it'll feel livelier in top on the road unless your always 130+ !!! Edited January 22, 2023 by DAZ Addition 1 Quote Link to comment
DAZ Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 As for porting etc try Roger Upperton in Leeds been tuning bikes forever,semi retired now I believe roger@uppertonracing.com but until you ask etc 1 Quote Link to comment
Captain Chaos Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 don't waste money on an ignition advancer. Make your own. Just slot the holes on the plate the pick-ups are amounted on, this gives you adjustable advance. One mm on the edge of the plate equals 1 degree. 2 Quote Link to comment
wraith Posted January 22, 2023 Share Posted January 22, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Captain Chaos said: don't waste money on an ignition advancer. Make your own. Just slot the holes on the plate the pick-ups are amounted on, this gives you adjustable advance. One mm on the edge of the plate equals 1 degree. You best also say which way to rotate it, clock wise or anti clockwise and pics are always good Edited January 22, 2023 by wraith 1 Quote Link to comment
coombehouse Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) I would probably come at this from another angle. Within the limits of what you wish to achieve & bearing in mind the low mileage on the motor, I would limit the engine mods to bolt ones & not strip the motor. Get a decent, proven exhaust system, degree the cams, service everything else & get some Dyno time with someone who understands carbs. Spend the rest of the cash on the chassis. Replace/inspect/lubricate all the bearings, get a quality shock, a fork revalve & service. Buy some new tyres. Maybe a brembo master cylinder None of this will have a negative affect on the future value of the bike should you choose to sell it Edited January 23, 2023 by coombehouse Typo 1 Quote Link to comment
Lachie04 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) I have a 1052 built up motor with a DOT head just a little port reshaping to remove casting ridge in the intake some deshrouding 38 flatties @ 12.5 compression (after deshrouding) and on a break in run on the Dyno pulled 5-8hp less than a local well prepared 1127 race bike and was second in 5 gsxr motored bikes. Having two modified motors both with DOT heads they certainly make them free rev. The 1052 makes good power to around 10500 thou in this configuration but feels like it would rev itself to death if I let it. Personally I wouldn't go past the flatties no problem with mid-range and so so so much easier to get right Edited January 23, 2023 by Lachie04 1 Quote Link to comment
DAZ Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, coombehouse said: I would probably come at this from another angle. Within the limits of what you wish to achieve & bearing in mind the low mileage on the motor, I would limit the engine mods to bolt ones & not strip the motor. Get a decent, proven exhaust system, degree the cams, service everything else & get some Dyno time with someone who understands carbs. Spend the rest of the cash on the chassis. Replace/inspect/lubricate all the bearings, get a quality shock, a fork revalve & service. Buy some new tyres. Maybe a brembo master cylinder None of this will have a negative affect on the future value of the bike should you choose to sell it Bang on, what I was on about in my 1st post,and @wraith said in his,it's a 35 year old classic bike tweak it, fettle it but accept it for what is so great about them. Others have developed theirs into fantastic carbon clad lightweight missiles but does Metralla want to go that route doesn't seem it to me Edited January 23, 2023 by DAZ Spelling and grammar 2 Quote Link to comment
Metralla Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 12 hours ago, coombehouse said: I would probably come at this from another angle. Within the limits of what you wish to achieve & bearing in mind the low mileage on the motor, I would limit the engine mods to bolt ones & not strip the motor. Get a decent, proven exhaust system, degree the cams, service everything else & get some Dyno time with someone who understands carbs. Spend the rest of the cash on the chassis. Replace/inspect/lubricate all the bearings, get a quality shock, a fork revalve & service. Buy some new tyres. Maybe a brembo master cylinder None of this will have a negative affect on the future value of the bike should you choose to sell it Not very different from what I was aiming to do actually. If I butcher blueprint a head, it will be Eblag donor. As for suspension and brakes I am going to that direction, but I do not want to use brembo M/C. Either the OEM or AP Racing CP3125, which has the period look. I have stripped the top end to inspect the cylinders as I couldn't believe it has that low mileage. Quote Link to comment
Gixer1460 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 Blueprinting anything is a waste of time and money UNLESS you are restricted by racing class regulations! It will cost more money to blueprint a head than to tune it for performance - don't kid yourself that it will be cheap! 3 Quote Link to comment
Metralla Posted September 12, 2023 Author Share Posted September 12, 2023 I have the bike almost ready (will post pics once finished) and I have a factorypro kit (not fitted). The only performance mod is a hindle full system. What do you recommend about jetting? Will I need to upjet? Only MJ? Do I need to raise needles? Do I need to increase pilot jet as well? Quote Link to comment
DAZ Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 I doubt with just a full system that the pilot jets will need changing as for the mains and needles ideally you'd put it on a Dyno where the afr can be seen to determine what it really needs, jetting carbs over the web is rarely as accurate as an O2 sensor up the tailpipe 2 Quote Link to comment
Upshotknothole Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 6 hours ago, Metralla said: I have the bike almost ready (will post pics once finished) and I have a factorypro kit (not fitted). The only performance mod is a hindle full system. What do you recommend about jetting? Will I need to upjet? Only MJ? Do I need to raise needles? Do I need to increase pilot jet as well? Follow the instructions that came with the factory pro kit. With only an exhaust on the bike, their stage 1 kit should be pretty close. 2 Quote Link to comment
Metralla Posted September 12, 2023 Author Share Posted September 12, 2023 I am asking in case someone already had tried this set up or a similar one and to see what to expect. I will do the dyno as well. 1 Quote Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.