Random GSX-1400 question

[Joseph]

Hi

Was randomly wondering whether the GSX 1400 could be fitted with a GSXR/GSF ignition plate and rotor, in order to easily run it with a stripped down electrical system using matching ECU and carbs ?

Or would it be a much more invested technical project to convert ?

[TonyGee]

no idea but if you can get the plate and rotor to fit and get the timing right i don't see why not 

[Joseph]

Yeah thats what i'm thining. I mean, if the crank fitting dimension of both rotors is the same, it's got to be just a question of timing.

 

 

Maybe 

[Wagola]

37 minutes ago, Joseph said:

Yeah thats what i'm thining. I mean, if the crank fitting dimension of both rotors is the same, it's got to be just a question of timing.

 

 

Maybe 

I concur !

[Joseph]

So that would mean you could do a basic EFI conversion on a GSXR or GSF using the 1400 ECU etc

Edited April 25, 2022 by Joseph

[TonyGee]

25 minutes ago, Joseph said:

So that would mean you could do a basic EFI conversion on a GSXR or GSF using the 1400 ECU etc

Noooooooo !!!!!!   EFI on a bandit/GSXR engine   give me carbs any day   

[Joseph]

Yeah i agree but for turbo maybe ? 

[TonyGee]

22 minutes ago, Joseph said:

Yeah i agree but for turbo maybe ? 

I don't do turbo's but yeah your probably right 

[davecara]

1 hour ago, Joseph said:

So that would mean you could do a basic EFI conversion on a GSXR or GSF using the 1400 ECU etc

You would need to find somewhere for a cam sensor and another way to trim the fuelling back a hell of a lot. Cheaper and easier going aftermarket ECU as per Arttu's thread. 1250 bandit stuff however....

[TonyGee]

24 minutes ago, davecara said:

You would need to find somewhere for a cam sensor and another way to trim the fuelling back a hell of a lot. Cheaper and easier going aftermarket ECU as per Arttu's thread. 1250 bandit stuff however....

yeah good point on the sensors it would need. as well as a fuel pump. 

[Joseph]

Ah yes indeed the cam sensor too. Fuel pump would be easy enough.

But anyways, initial theory was about carbing a 1400 and that would be a cool gig

[Gixer1460]

21 hours ago, Joseph said:

So that would mean you could do a basic EFI conversion on a GSXR or GSF using the 1400 ECU etc

No - it wouldn't work as the 1400 ECU needs the 1400 rotor which if memory serves me right, is on the starter clutch / alternator rotor like Busa's etc? To use a GSXR oil cooled ignition it has to be complete system - CDI, rotor and pick-ups and conversely EFI conversion needs the whole install so the ECU understands the signals its getting or not getting! EFI conversions are better served with aftermarket ECU's for flexibility in component selection.

[Joseph]

Really not sure about any of this (especially EFI ), you have more experience with these lumps than me. However this is the ignition signal setup on a 1400 :

Looks familiar enough

[davecara]

1 hour ago, Gixer1460 said:

No - it wouldn't work as the 1400 ECU needs the 1400 rotor which if memory serves me right, is on the starter clutch / alternator rotor like Busa's etc? To use a GSXR oil cooled ignition it has to be complete system - CDI, rotor and pick-ups and conversely EFI conversion needs the whole install so the ECU understands the signals its getting or not getting! EFI conversions are better served with aftermarket ECU's for flexibility in component selection.

Not strictly true as you can go fuel only with the stock CDI or conversely Ignition only if you want to be able to program your advance curve

[Gixer1460]

5 hours ago, Joseph said:

Really not sure about any of this (especially EFI ), you have more experience with these lumps than me. However this is the ignition signal setup on a 1400 :

Looks familiar enough

Looks std GSXR11 with a different rotor - using that with std GSXR11 CDI will confuse the hell out of it. So, could you use the std GSX14 ECU running ignition only if using carbs fitted. Will the ECU actually work if it doesn't 'see' any injection stuff - possibly throw up errors?

4 hours ago, davecara said:

Not strictly true as you can go fuel only with the stock CDI or conversely Ignition only if you want to be able to program your advance curve

Are you talking GSX14 or GSXR11/7 'CDI' as the former is strictly an ECU. Otherwise see reply above. Its an interesting concept nonetheless!

[TonyGee]

It would be interesting to see a set of carbs on a GSX1400 Joseph, and how it performs 

[colinworth79]

I would say it would work . I would mount the gsxr crank sensor and remove some of the pick up points on gsx rotor to replicate the gsxr one . Obviously the sensor and rotor point would have to be in the same position to TDC as the original . Think an ignitech box would be better so you could play with the timing and rev limit .  

[Tony Nitrous]

On 4/27/2022 at 2:01 AM, TonyGee said:

It would be interesting to see a set of carbs on a GSX1400 Joseph, and how it performs 

Aren’t the throttle body’s and inlets in the head relatively small (for a 1402cc motor) part of the engines design for lowdown grunt.    I know they suffer from being oddly spaced in comparison to other models.  The 14 being a stand alone engine, even wider across the cases. 

Obviously still do-able but not a quick swap over.  I did look into it briefly for mine.  I’d be interested if anyone does it. 
 

 

 

Edited July 13, 2022 by Tony Nitrous

[Joseph]

Yes, thats the idea behind the low HP and good torque i guess.

When i mention converting to carbs i was thinking something like RS36 ?

[Panos]

On 7/13/2022 at 4:07 AM, Tony Nitrous said:

Aren’t the throttle body’s and inlets in the head relatively small (for a 1402cc motor) part of the engines design for lowdown grunt.    I know they suffer from being oddly spaced in comparison to other models.  The 14 being a stand alone engine, even wider across the cases. 

Obviously still do-able but not a quick swap over.  I did look into it briefly for mine.  I’d be interested if anyone does it. 
 

 

 

I have seen some youtube videos with fcr carbs on gsx 1400 , looks like a common mod in Japan .

My brother just sold his  recently these bike are getting rare here .

[Gixer1460]

13 hours ago, Panos said:

I have seen some youtube videos with fcr carbs on gsx 1400 , looks like a common mod in Japan .

Listening to that . . . . . . . . what a mistake ! As stock, they came with small TB's cos the inlets were small also - all for torque not HP! Unless you hog out the inlets, larger valves, putting FCR41's is a exercise in futility!

[Joseph]

Yeah that can't be an ideal setup. Again simple small RS carbs should open it up without confusing the airflow 

[Tony Nitrous]

27 minutes ago, Gixer1460 said:

Listening to that . . . . . . . . what a mistake ! As stock, they came with small TB's cos the inlets were small also - all for torque not HP! Unless you hog out the inlets, larger valves, putting FCR41's is a exercise in futility!

There was a bit of a monster 14 running as a drag bike a while back. I’m not sure if it ran injectors or carbs, but there was a lot of work put into the head, inlets etc to wake it up.  
 

I’ve seen two bikes here with 1620 conversions but you need a pile of money and a pile of parts.   I like mine but it has its limits in comparison with many other models.

 

[Tony Nitrous]

They respond really well to a full Yoshi Cyclone or Akra full system, PAIR blanks and a dyno mapped PC3 or 5. Few folk bother with an ECU flash as unlike modern bikes the 14 has very few things to remap other than fueling, plus only the later bikes have a “flash” ECU option listed.     Next step is normally cams.   After that you’re into serious stuff and serious $$’s.  

 

Edited July 18, 2022 by Tony Nitrous

[Blubber]

2 hours ago, Tony Nitrous said:

There was a bit of a monster 14 running as a drag bike a while back. I’m not sure if it ran injectors or carbs, but there was a lot of work put into the head, inlets etc to wake it up.  
 

I’ve seen two bikes here with 1620 conversions but you need a pile of money and a pile of parts.   I like mine but it has its limits in comparison with many other models.

 

That probably could be John McLean from Mclean racing