GS 750 cam holder question

[Kevref]

Hi guys a question about cam holder covers. These are matched to each cam at production, so what  do you do when  you replace cams? If you have to match then with the new cams  , what clearances are required?

many thanks 

Edited January 14, 2022 by Kevref
Typo

[Captain Chaos]

they are matched to the head, not the camshafts. Should always stay in the location they came in from the factory.

[Gixer1460]

And for future reference / info, they are usually referred to as 'cam caps' - at first I thought you were talking about the cam cover LOL!

[wraith]

As above, they come matched to the head, if you're buy a new head and it doesn't have the cam caps leave it.

You can put new ones on or swap them if needed but it's not good and very hit and miss, I've seen them to lose and you get cam float or to small and it locks the cam up.

Some people have managed to get a smaller one to fit by using value grinding paste and lapping the cam in. Like say it's all a bit hit and miss 

Why do you need to change them?

[Swiss Toni]

You’re over thinking it. If you’re changing cams for performance reasons, just change the cams! Keep the caps in order, A B C & D. Can’t go wrong. 

[Isleoman]

I don't discount the advice above and would certainly follow those recommendations for my own equipment.

 

Having said that  I would like to see a TV / Youtube show where these types of recommendations are "experimented  with" (think myth busters for bikes).    There's a lot of "line bore" advice that I'm sure is absolutely correct but I'd still like to see someone else do an experiment with their equipment for my entertainment and see how it holds up.     

Mixed matched cases,  swapped cam caps etc.    Why would I find that interesting?  Well for one thing I think production machining has advanced and is much more precise than it was in the 70s / 80s   so the story line of my show would involve doing what you shouldn't do on older and newer bikes.     

Again I believe the advice given above is sound, but I like seeing what happens when advice isn't followed "by others".   The show could be called "Old Wive's Tales" or "Doubting Thomas" or "Post Apocalypse Builds'.    I think the problem for the story line might be that it may take more than a few miles of use before the shite happens.  

 

 

 

 

 

[Swiss Toni]

As has been mentioned on numerous occasions, yes, head and caps are line bored as a set. And, you really shouldn’t mix and match. But, if you’re in a position like you’ve lost/broken one/two caps, and have access to spares, what you got to lose? The procedure is well known. These old GS’s are bombproof, and with a bit of love, will go on forever! 

[wraith]

2 hours ago, Isleoman said:

I don't discount the advice above and would certainly follow those recommendations for my own equipment.

 

Having said that  I would like to see a TV / Youtube show where these types of recommendations are "experimented  with" (think myth busters for bikes).    There's a lot of "line bore" advice that I'm sure is absolutely correct but I'd still like to see someone else do an experiment with their equipment for my entertainment and see how it holds up.     

Mixed matched cases,  swapped cam caps etc.    Why would I find that interesting?  Well for one thing I think production machining has advanced and is much more precise than it was in the 70s / 80s   so the story line of my show would involve doing what you shouldn't do on older and newer bikes.     

Again I believe the advice given above is sound, but I like seeing what happens when advice isn't followed "by others".   The show could be called "Old Wive's Tales" or "Doubting Thomas" or "Post Apocalypse Builds'.    I think the problem for the story line might be that it may take more than a few miles of use before the shite happens.  

 

 

 

 

 

Best thing for you to do, is buy a gs1000 engine remove the cam caps buy so other caps and put them on. See how far you get. Ever the cams will not turn (done this) or you start the engine up and all you can hear is the cans tapping.

O and just to make it worth doing so we can all have a laugh, you MUST throw away the original cam caps weeks before you get another set so you can't chet  so go and bust that miff 

[Wolf]

If you are in the disposition of needing to replace cam caps and your cams are worn on journals why not rather have a machine shop re-linebore journals   resurface cams to fit white metal bearings or needle rollers ?

At least (if my previos advise is shit ) use a plastic gauge before turning engine over . . . 

[gs7_11]

Ask VF750 owners what happens with non-line bored cam caps. 

Lottery time!

[imago]

Purely anecdotal, but the 8v heads seem to be more sensitive to variations between caps than the 16v. Presumably that's because of improved manufacturing techniques?

In any event, the give away is looking at the parts diagrams for them and you'll see that the caps come with the cylinder head and aren't available separately.

Also worth bearing in mind that the two bolt caps will go on either way round and that will cause them to pinch too.

[PanzerWomble]

My pal used to shim single cam Honderz ( wet dreams mainly) with scraps of coke cans back in the day ....I crap you not .

 

"Well it's all aluminium " he would add when I'd question his methods over beer or so in the back yard .

 

Shocked the engineer in me to the core, however , shimmed they would be , run they would for 20 minutes , and in Yellow pages they went .

He was a big lad with a passion for matt black chops .......as few customers came back to complain it must have worked ok ....I'm guessing 

[TonyGee]

reminds me back in the 80's when i worked in a car garage, we had a little Vietnamese guy who was one of the boat people who got a job at our spot, he was rebuilding a crank on a car engine and i saw him tearing up some silver foil out of his fag packet, he then put it under the shell bearing to pack it out !!!!!!!!!  I said we dont do that in this garage we put new ones in, he said in his country that how they did it ????  he wouldn't have it so I just walked away as he took another swag of his Saki     

[wraith]

Just look when they did in Cuba to keep cars running before the USA decided to be friendly to them 

There's doing it right and proper and then there's just get and keep it running.

Back in the day I had a Ho##a 750 the main fuse was a nail as 30 amp just blow, it worked didn't give me any greeth so I just left it there 

[Swiss Toni]

On 1/18/2022 at 2:31 PM, gs7_11 said:

Ask VF750 owners what happens with non-line bored cam caps. 

Lottery time!

The original VF had a poor camshaft lubrication system. Many owner mods done with external system to cams. Nearly did old Soichiro in! Is that not what you’re thinking about?

[TonyGee]

17 minutes ago, Swiss Toni said:

The original VF had a poor camshaft lubrication system. Many owner mods done with external system to cams. Nearly did old Soichiro in! Is that not what you’re thinking about?

they did Toni, had to do a couple years ago, fucking horrible job. never again.  

[gs7_11]

22 minutes ago, Swiss Toni said:

The original VF had a poor camshaft lubrication system. Many owner mods done with external system to cams. Nearly did old Soichiro in! Is that not what you’re thinking about?

 No.

[gs7_11]

I had a VF750F in 86/87

The problem on that bike was that the cam caps were not line-bored. Gurls blouse thought they could mayke them precisely enough without line boring.

They were wrong.

Some bikes were fine, others weren't

 

 

Edited January 19, 2022 by Captain Chaos

[Captain Chaos]

Enough talk of fucking H's.

OP's question is answered, mission accomplished.