Stock hose clamps doesn't clamp enough, false air leak.

[gorbys]

Been having some driveability issues and trouble getting a stable idle and I've traced it down to the hose clamps not being tight enough. (they're screwed in as much as possible but they are really old) 

So I bought new universal hose clamps but they where to wide to fit in the grooves of the intake rubber and pretty much squeezed the rubbers of the intake pipes. 

So now I'm wondering if I should look for other narrower type hose clamps or buy new oem ones? I'm just afraid new oem ones aren't gonna clamp down hard enough either... Or could the old ones have stretched over the years and that's why they can't seal my new intake rubbers? 

[Joseph]

Whats your setup ?

[wraith]

You can get stainless steel ones off the bay set of 8 for carb rubber inlet x4 and x4 for the air box side.

Some people will only use OEM, that's down to you.

[Gixer1460]

It's not the hose clamps - the OEM are designed for the job! - it's the rubbers, they go hard and eventually whatever clamp you use, they'll leak! You need some new ones to give a reliable seal.

[TonyGee]

don't over tighten them as well as they can split the rubber   

thats the none OEM ones by the way as they dont have a curved edge 

Edited July 31, 2022 by TonyGee

[gorbys]

4 hours ago, Joseph said:

Whats your setup ?

Gsx1100 engine with hindle exhaust and kn filters. Dynojet kit

2 hours ago, Gixer1460 said:

It's not the hose clamps - the OEM are designed for the job! - it's the rubbers, they go hard and eventually whatever clamp you use, they'll leak! You need some new ones to give a reliable seal.

The rubbers are brand new. 

2 hours ago, TonyGee said:

don't over tighten them as well as they can split the rubber   

thats the none OEM ones by the way as they dont have a curved edge 

That's why I removed the new ones I was concerned that could happen 

[gorbys]

4 hours ago, wraith said:

You can get stainless steel ones off the bay set of 8 for carb rubber inlet x4 and x4 for the air box side.

Some people will only use OEM, that's down to you.

What concerns me about oem is that I'm using oem now (altough x amount of years old) and they're not making brand new rubbers seal. If I buy new ones will they be any tighter? Could the old ones have stretched? 

[Gixer1460]

38 minutes ago, gorbys said:

 

 

39 minutes ago, gorbys said:

The rubbers are brand new. 

 

38 minutes ago, gorbys said:

What concerns me about oem is that I'm using oem now (altough x amount of years old) and they're not making brand new rubbers seal. If I buy new ones will they be any tighter? Could the old ones have stretched? 

OEM or pattern? rubbers. Wire clips unlikely to stretch so guessing poor rubbers?

Edited July 31, 2022 by Gixer1460

[gorbys]

13 minutes ago, Gixer1460 said:

 

 

OEM or pattern? rubbers. Wire clips unlikely to stretch so guessing poor rubbers?

Nope they're original suzuki parts 

[Gixer1460]

4 minutes ago, gorbys said:

Nope they're original suzuki parts 

'Tis very odd then!

Correct carbs? I'm guessing they would be 34's but even with 36's they should seal, even when stretched!

[wraith]

Daft question, you've not got smaller carbs in for the rubbers?

Say bandit or gsxr 36mm carb rubbers with 34mm carbs?

[eddiegsx]

You suggested in your opening post that you have traced the problem to the carb rubbers not sealing, by purchasing new ones can we assume you've eliminated that issue???

What was your original process of elimination? Would it be worth re checking everything again? 

Sometimes even the most able amongst us (I'm certainly nowhere near that standard btw) can get bamboozled by a problem and overlook the obvious.

Just an observation so don't take offence. Good luck. 

[gorbys]

4 hours ago, Gixer1460 said:

'Tis very odd then!

Correct carbs? I'm guessing they would be 34's but even with 36's they should seal, even when stretched!

 

56 minutes ago, wraith said:

Daft question, you've not got smaller carbs in for the rubbers?

Say bandit or gsxr 36mm carb rubbers with 34mm carbs?

I can only assume, all the ancillaries came in a box along with the engine. 

The original rubbers where hard as a rock and that's why I bought new ones. Ordered them from wemoto for a GSX1100sz model. Which should be the engine I have. 

Should they slip on easy or should there be a noticeable resistance? 

They go on and off both the intake runners and the carbs easily. 

11 minutes ago, eddiegsx said:

You suggested in your opening post that you have traced the problem to the carb rubbers not sealing, by purchasing new ones can we assume you've eliminated that issue???

What was your original process of elimination? Would it be worth re checking everything again? 

Sometimes even the most able amongst us (I'm certainly nowhere near that standard btw) can get bamboozled by a problem and overlook the obvious.

Just an observation so don't take offence. Good luck. 

Thats how I found out, I originally sprayed starter fluid around the flanges and nothing happened so I went around in circles checking everything else, then just for the hell of it I went back again with the starter fluid and properly doused the flanges and after a few seconds the engine died.

New hose clamps made it better and for the first time since assembling this bike I could get a mostly stable idle. But the hose clamps I bought are probably doing more harm than good as they're too wide and are squeezing the rubbers off the runners and could potentially tear them

[wraith]

There should be some resistance, you normally have to give them a good push to get them to pop in.

If they just full in something is not right.

[Dezza]

Are you sure you have the correct clips for the bike? The correct rubber/clip combo is designed to work best as they tighten up nicely but it's impossible to overtighten and crack the rubbers As Tony states, jubilee style clips can be easily overtightened causing your expensive new rubbers to crack. It sounds like you have the wrong clips so that when fully closed they still don't grip the rubbers enough. EFEs have the largest OEM carbs for aircooled bikes so you may have EFE clips or even clips from another make bike. Alternatively if you have pattern rubbers, the rubbers may have slightly thinner walls than OEM so the correct clips don't tighten up enough when they reach the limit.

[gorbys]

3 hours ago, Dezza said:

Are you sure you have the correct clips for the bike? The correct rubber/clip combo is designed to work best as they tighten up nicely but it's impossible to overtighten and crack the rubbers As Tony states, jubilee style clips can be easily overtightened causing your expensive new rubbers to crack. It sounds like you have the wrong clips so that when fully closed they still don't grip the rubbers enough. EFEs have the largest OEM carbs for aircooled bikes so you may have EFE clips or even clips from another make bike. Alternatively if you have pattern rubbers, the rubbers may have slightly thinner walls than OEM so the correct clips don't tighten up enough when they reach the limit.

I've read this on another page as well.

My oem clips can bottom out, like I can tighten them until both ends touch. Is that correct or are they too big? In my mind it's the latter... 

[Dezza]

7 hours ago, gorbys said:

I've read this on another page as well.

My oem clips can bottom out, like I can tighten them until both ends touch. Is that correct or are they too big? In my mind it's the latter... 

They should 'bottom out.' But when they do so, if there is the correct rubber/clip combo, the carbs will be held firmly and there won't be any leaks. So my guess is your clips are too big, the rubbers have walls thinner than they should or possibly a combination of both.

[Joseph]

Yeah off the top of my head shouldn't there be a couple of mm left between the tabs upon decent final tightening ?

Edited August 1, 2022 by Joseph

[Gixer1460]

2 hours ago, Joseph said:

Yeah off the top of my head shouldn't there be a couple of mm left between the tabs upon decent final tightening ?

That's my thoughts also - if they do bottom, they are over-tight or rubbers are dead!

[TonyGee]

after years of heat their sometimes forms a recess where the clamp sinks into the rubber,  this reduces the circumference and the clip will not fully tighten.  

[gorbys]

But the rubbers are brand new(oem suzuki). The clamps are old. So based on what you guys are telling me then the clamps are probably too big then. 

I'm gonna try order some new ones. 

[bitzz]

Regular worm gear clamps are 1/2" wide, carb boot clamps are 5/16", so they'll fit into the slot in the rubber

[gorbys]

New clamps. Still bottoming out. 

However, I discovered something today that is also problematic and may have been throwing me off. So I've been having trouble obtaining steady idle as mentioned. Now I can get a steady idle but not a low steady idle. Like I set it at 1100, give it a revup and now we're at 1900! Or it'll go down to 1100 again and then go lower and eventually die.... Its like there is no in-between and finding that sweet spot is super hard. 

So in anger while my idle was revving up I stuck my thumbs on the throttle linkage either side and pretty much forced it shut. And voila, low and steady idle... I let go of the linkage and it holds the low idle for a little bit then starts creeping up again. So there is definitely something going on with the linkage/throttle assembly as well... Anyone have some ideas? 

[coombehouse]

Strangely enough, I bought a new genuine set of carb rubbers for an ez a few years ago & had a similar problem with sealing at the joint between the rubber & the head. The rubber to carb was fine as I was using rs38s. The symptom was the same, a hanging idle. I haven't sorted it yet as other things happened. 

The rubbers do not appear to be as good quality as other genuine rubbers I have bought for my katana about 10 years ago or the set I bought last week for yet another project. Makes me wonder whether there has been a tooling issue or change somewhere along the way.

[Safra]

Sorry to hijack has anyone used intercooler hose as replacements for these hoses I'm having a hard time finding them new on my end of the world