majortom4 Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 So i'm guessing as you can tell by the title i'm planning on turboing my bandit 1200 on some what of a budget. Now i am no expert at turboing and have never done anything like this before so going to be a massive learning experience and hoping to log my build, findings and probably some fails along the way. Hoping that some kind people here could help me along the way as well.All input is appreciated so thanks in advance Quote
majortom4 Posted September 3, 2015 Author Posted September 3, 2015 Ok so first things first is i am looking to make a blow through system for my carbed bike as i don't want to go through the EFI route. I have done a lot of reading over the last week of how other people have done their turbo projects and also a lot of research into what turbo would be good to use. I am hoping to hit the 200+ bhp mark with this and have looked into compression maps for capable turbos. The ones which have caught my eye are the TD05H and the T04B as these are easy to obtain for a reasonable price. Any inputs about turbo selection would be helpful as i have yet to buy one next is getting together a list of parts that i am going to either need to buy or fabricate (get someone to help me fabricate) Quote
majortom4 Posted September 3, 2015 Author Posted September 3, 2015 So here is the list so far of what i think i am going to need.Turbo (obviously), Downpipes and exhaust flange for turbo, Waste dump pipe and flange for this, Wastegate, Oil feed and return lines for turbo, Cone filter, plenum chamber, air intake pipe with pitot tube, blow off valve, boost gauge, fuel pump, fuel pressure regulator. inline fuel filter, all necessary vacuum lines and fuel lines and connectors.Have i missed anything? also is it needed to have a one way valve for the oil feed and return valve? and does the oil feed need to be pressurised/have an oil pump in there? Quote
Captain Chaos Posted September 4, 2015 Posted September 4, 2015 Ground control to major tom (sorry couldn't resist)You'll also need a fuel pressure gauge (to compare with the boost while riding), a wideband sensor and AFR gauge, and probably also a scavenge pump for the turbo oil drain. The oil feed to the turbo is best taken from the plug at the end of the main galery (under the ignition pickup cover) with a restriction in it.Whatever budget you have in mind, multiply it by 2 and you will get close. 2 Quote
vizman Posted September 4, 2015 Posted September 4, 2015 ....some half decent pistons, a lock-up clutch, big boy pants.... Quote
majortom4 Posted September 4, 2015 Author Posted September 4, 2015 ....some half decent pistons, a lock-up clutch, big boy pants....what sort of Pistons could be used on a budget. Heard ppl talking about old busa piston? Straight swap or missing needed?was hoping to get away with putting a heavy duty spring in for the time being until I get some more money together. Surely im going to need my little boy panties for when I shit myself? Quote
majortom4 Posted September 4, 2015 Author Posted September 4, 2015 Ground control to major tom (sorry couldn't resist)You'll also need a fuel pressure gauge (to compare with the boost while riding), a wideband sensor and AFR gauge, and probably also a scavenge pump for the turbo oil drain. The oil feed to the turbo is best taken from the plug at the end of the main galery (under the ignition pickup cover) with a restriction in it.Whatever budget you have in mind, multiply it by 2 and you will get close.now I am impressed with how quick the ground control came out! Good work sir!thanks for adding those things. Would have forgotten about the scavenge pump and had a smoky ass bike!! Will get a fuel pressure gauge as well.probably having a special moment but AFR gauge?? Really hoping to have use of the dyno at uni for the setting up but if not then yes will get a wide band air metre.will hopefully get this build underway over the next few weeks after I have got my turbo sorted. Then will be the fun job of mocking everything up.pictures to come! Quote
Gixer1460 Posted September 4, 2015 Posted September 4, 2015 (edited) A scavenge pump isn't necessarily required - all depends on how well you fabricate the exhaust manifold! Get the turbo high enough and gravity drain is still practical. Personally i'm not a fan of electrical suction type pumps and use a mechanical, crank driven scavenge - always there, always working. Also budget for a decent ignition as a weak spark will not light a boosted cylinder!AFR gauge - Wideband Lambda - damn near essential for tuning etc. Edited September 4, 2015 by Gixer1460 Quote
majortom4 Posted September 4, 2015 Author Posted September 4, 2015 Ok fair play. Hadn't heard about needing a scavenge pump until reading on here but the use of one makes sense to me but yer all the turbos I have seen haven't had one. So if I get the manifold really nice and high then I can use gravity and save the £50 for a pump and stick it towards a lock up or Pistons?looking at welding up 1.2mm steel for the manifold. Good shout or needs to be thicker? Quote
Gixer1460 Posted September 4, 2015 Posted September 4, 2015 On a blow through the ex. manifold is carrying a lot of weight on very short tubes - 2mm 304 or 316 stainless is sort of standard spec - some form of hangers to share the weight onto the frame will help. A lot of installs have the elec. pumps hidden down low so just cos you can't see them doesn't mean their not there!A high turbo is easy to say - not necessarily easy to achieve! The rad., the wheel and suspension movement all conspire to make it difficult! Quote
majortom4 Posted September 4, 2015 Author Posted September 4, 2015 Hmmmm I'll see how it goes and maybe just go with the pump then to be safe.will an intercoller be a clever idea if I was to keep the stock piston for a while on low boost (like 5-6psi) then get some shiny ones along with the lock up clutch and then smash the boost up? Quote
Gixer1460 Posted September 4, 2015 Posted September 4, 2015 On low boost - intercooler waste of time! Stock pistons if you can keep low boost - maybe ok..... but I bet you won't! Busa piston cheap alternative as they are forged as stock from memory but like anything a bad tune will kill them just as easy!An IC is worthwhile only if you are pushing higher boost consistantly ie Bar and a half and more, when air intake temps start skyrocketting! Causes other complications as the ideal place compromises air flow to the oil rad so affects engine reliability - everything has to be factored in! Quote
majortom4 Posted September 4, 2015 Author Posted September 4, 2015 Ok so no need for the intercoooler thanks.will look into busa Pistons.do they just slot streight onto bandit rods and streight into the block or does that need to be bored out?i know I won't be able to keep it at low boost but for at least the first period I will have to until I can get the lock up clutch. Quote
majortom4 Posted September 4, 2015 Author Posted September 4, 2015 (edited) so heres some pics then of the lady before i start.shes a bit dirty but will be filthy when i finish Edited September 4, 2015 by majortom4 wrong link Quote
Gixer1460 Posted September 4, 2015 Posted September 4, 2015 (edited) Get Mk1 Busa pistons with 20mm pins as will fit blandit rods - the later mk2 ones have 18mm pinsAs they are 81mm dia. the block will need boring. Bak in the day the best turbo ready pistons were 80mm MTC GSX1150 - perfect deck ht. and compression was right, and thy were strong! Not sure if anyone does a specific turbo piston off the shelf as they need a thick crown to machine a bowl into, flat tops are ok but don't burn as well as a bowl and decent squish at the edges! Edited September 4, 2015 by Gixer1460 Quote
majortom4 Posted September 4, 2015 Author Posted September 4, 2015 Ok cheers will keep an eye out for some Pistons.so with the re-bore is it just a simple widen or does the barrel need to be lined or anything? Also what will I then have to do with the CR? Not that wise on piston changes and re-bores and compression ratings. (On my list of things to read up about now) Quote
Gixer1460 Posted September 4, 2015 Posted September 4, 2015 Re Comp. Ratio see here........ http://oldskoolsuzuki.info/forums/index.php?/topic/885-gsxr1300-pistions-and-750-dot-head/&page=1 Quote
majortom4 Posted September 4, 2015 Author Posted September 4, 2015 Cheers buddy read through that. Confused the hell out of me at first but kinda got there in the end. Going to go through it again just to make sure I got it. Quote
Phill106 Posted September 4, 2015 Posted September 4, 2015 Cheers buddy read through that. Confused the hell out of me at first but kinda got there in the end. Going to go through it again just to make sure I got it.don't worry it still confuses the fuck out of me. Lol Quote
majortom4 Posted September 5, 2015 Author Posted September 5, 2015 (edited) Yer still confused.......so correct me if I'm wrong I need to get the busa Pistons sitting 1mm below deck to get the compression ratio I want for turboing? And to achieve this (if above or dead on deck) I just use a bigger base gasket??so still on hunt for a turbo as the ones I was looking at didn't come through. Pissing me off......any suggestions from personal experience which is a good turbo for my bandit? Edited September 5, 2015 by majortom4 Wrong word Quote
Fula28 Posted September 5, 2015 Posted September 5, 2015 Try one from Volvo. T5or v70 its Mitsubishi (13150) made unit. Get a straight flange Td04hl-16t . It's built in blow off valve. Cheap enough unit and good for 350bhp. Quote
Duckndive Posted September 5, 2015 Posted September 5, 2015 Yer still confused.......so correct me if I'm wrong I need to get the busa Pistons sitting 1mm below deck to get the compression ratio I want for turboing?I don't think so ..Have you actually worked out what the C/R is with the parts you are using ?What is your target C/R .... Quote
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