Clutch preferences .B12

[Foz]

In two minds whether to swap from my current set up of the standard B12 diaphragm clutch with one HD and one standard Spring along with an fbm lock up and fit a gsxr750 04 5 Spring clutch set up with HD springs . Anybody fitted the 5 Spring to a B12 engine ? What are folks opinions ,preferences ?

[Duckndive]

If you need to cure BHP induced slip then just fit a lock up....

if you want a clutch you can fine tune for drag racing ....stick a coil spring clutch and lock up in it 

PS Blandit baskets tend to disintegrate with silly BHP 

Edited June 17, 2017 by Duckndive

[Foz]

It originally slipped at 143 on the dyno so when a lock up and spacer plate came up at the right money I just fitted them . There's part of me curious as to whether a Spring clutch with HD springs would A. Hold the power ok B. Just give a nicer feel, action when in use

[Duckndive]

18 minutes ago, Foz said:

It originally slipped at 143 on the dyno so when a lock up and spacer plate came up at the right money I just fitted them . There's part of me curious as to whether a Spring clutch with HD springs would A. Hold the power ok B. Just give a nicer feel, action when in use

TBH  if the original action was ok you don't need the HD spring with the lock up.....

[wraith]

On 17/06/2017 at 5:41 PM, Duckndive said:

 

PS Blandit baskets tend to disintegrate with silly BHP 

What you call silly BHP ?

I've heard many b12 riders where their bikes are putting apx 140-150 bhp at the wheel and have just fitted a HD spring and have done lots of miles with no problems.

I ask this because I'm going to be starting to build up the b12 motor with ported dot head etc. 

[Duckndive]

15 minutes ago, wraith said:

What you call silly BHP ?

I've heard many b12 riders where their bikes are putting apx 140-150 bhp at the wheel and have just fitted a HD spring and have done lots of miles with no problems.

I ask this because I'm going to be starting to build up the b12 motor with ported dot head etc. 

Well BHP is not silly as we all love it..... but I would not stick 200BHP thru one and expect it to last ....IMHO

Waits for Member to Enter Stage left who regularly does and has no probs.................

Edited June 18, 2017 by Duckndive

[wraith]

14 hours ago, Duckndive said:

 

Waits for Member to Enter Stage left who regularly does and has no probs.................

 always one 

[Gixer1460]

16 hours ago, Duckndive said:

Waits for Member to Enter Stage left who regularly does and has no probs.................

Or they go to a hinkey dyno who say its got 200hp ! ! !   

[Foz]

To be fair a lot of the fbm turbo bandits are just using the standard basket with a lock up. A lot of the 1216 engines are in the 200 bhp area . One springs to mind at 205 bhp that's been drag raced, toured and just used for the last 6 years without an issue.

 I was more interested in the feel between the two as the bandit clutch does seem quite on/ off

[wraith]

May help, just put a clutch slave on miss W. GSXR 1100, it had the 35mm piston slave but put the 38mm one on and that has made a big change to the clutch, much lighter and a smoother feel.

As to FBM had bad experience with them saying one thing and it not being right, so would not take there word for gospel. 

[Duckndive]

3 hours ago, Foz said:

To be fair a lot of the fbm turbo bandits are just using the standard basket with a lock up. A lot of the 1216 engines are in the 200 bhp area . One springs to mind at 205 bhp that's been drag raced, toured and just used for the last 6 years without an issue.

 I was more interested in the feel between the two as the bandit clutch does seem quite on/ off

personally any alloy clutch basket that the maker put a  band-aid steel strap around to hold it together is a week point when adding more HP than the maker envisaged....

most only add the lock-up to stop slip and not for its original purpose  "curve ball" and rarely actually understand how to tune it for its original purpose  

that aside IMHO and experience the Diaphram blandit or gsxr unit with a lock up is far less tuneable than a coil spring unit for either purpose ...

I have seen many diaphram units with lock-ups where the owners run extra springs and moan about the action being heavy and on off  "no 5hit Sherlock" 

INHO the coil spring unit is a far better set up all round......

Eg my last road turbo efe made around 180bhp at 6psi .....I ran 3 springs "out of an original 6" with a lock up running 1 bolt and nut on 3 stands and one bolt and 2 nuts on 3 stands ...it was a 2 finger pull and never slipped ................ but they say its a dark art and I have burnt many plates over the years so I guess it must be.............. ps I also don't like the hydraulic operation either I prefer cable

Edited June 19, 2017 by Duckndive

[wraith]

You could always convert the hydraulic to cable by using a b6 or gsx750f sprocket cover.

[Duckndive]

41 minutes ago, wraith said:

You could always convert the hydraulic to cable by using a b6 or gsx750f sprocket cover.

B6 is what I used with a t-pot cable

 

[MeanBean49]

Genuine suzuki plates and h/d spring has always been fine for me up to 150bhp

Standard everything apart from lockup clutch has been fine for me for the last 4 years with 280bhp and 200lbs ft. Doing loads of miles, speed trials and heavy track use

As for feel, use a ducati clutch master with h/d spring, makes the clutch mega light and really nice to use.

Only problems ive had is the basket strating to come loose on the rivets that hold it onto the primary, basket itself has been fine, and because of the torque, i have to have a lot of weight on the lockup, bike wants to creep a bit if i try to get away to quick

 

[Duckndive]

2 hours ago, MeanBean49 said:

Genuine suzuki plates and h/d spring has always been fine for me up to 150bhp

Standard everything apart from lockup clutch has been fine for me for the last 4 years with 280bhp and 200lbs ft. Doing loads of miles, speed trials and heavy track use

As for feel, use a ducati clutch master with h/d spring, makes the clutch mega light and really nice to use.

Only problems ive had is the basket strating to come loose on the rivets that hold it onto the primary, basket itself has been fine, and because of the torque, i have to have a lot of weight on the lockup, bike wants to creep a bit if i try to get away to quick

 

Excellent info

But why use the H,D spring with the lock up 

[MeanBean49]

2 hours ago, Duckndive said:

Excellent info

But why use the H,D spring with the lock up 

Who mentioned Hd spring with lockup? 

Hd spring and standard plates up to 150 bhp

Standard clutch with lockup for my turbo setup

Edited June 20, 2017 by MeanBean49

[Duckndive]

4 minutes ago, MeanBean49 said:

Who mentioned Hd spring with lockup? 

Hd spring and standard plates up to 150 bhp

Standard clutch with lockup for my turbo setup

that's what happens when I use me phone to read posts..........New Eyes needed.........

[MeanBean49]

Just now, Duckndive said:

that's what happens when I use me phone to read posts..........New Eyes needed.........

I have trouble typing. 95% of things i post i end up editing to correct stuff my fat fingers have messed up

[Solcambs]

21 hours ago, MeanBean49 said:

I have trouble typing. 95% of things i post i end up editing to correct stuff my fat fingers have messed up

That's me that is! Though mostly it's I don't read the post before I hit "Submit Reply" and really should have thought it through a little more carefully - premature ejac postulation you could say!

Edited June 21, 2017 by Solcambs

[suzook12]

I had the coil spring conversion on mine, felt lighter than stock B12, ran silkolene pro4 and had no slip at all on std springs but a very well protected motor. Cost me around £100 to do and never got touched again through many years of hard riding. Had torn out 2 stock clutches within a 1000 miles, barnet lasted a whacking 15 miles!! I did a 1340 using teapot clutch (similar to slabby) and had no issues with that either, again using pro4 and developing a healthy 155 ponies with nigh on 100lb/ft of torque....

[jonny1bump]

stock 1100 m clutch with one heavy duty diaphram  and one standard found good for 160 hp.  Any more listen to turbo guys they will certainly know what works.

Fact is Bandit clutch is weak put them on bench next to each other you can visual see without measuring.

Edited June 26, 2017 by jonny1bump

[baza]

My 1216 Bandit has done 55,000m with original clutch put the H/D springs in about 40,000m ago no issues.

[Cluffy]

On 6/19/2017 at 9:02 PM, wraith said:

You could always convert the hydraulic to cable by using a b6 or gsx750f sprocket cover.

I run cable on all my engines using this setup. I originally intended to put on a hydraulic at some point but I prefer the cable feel.

[boilerdude]

All this is making me want to just build my 1052 motor instead... ported dot head. Slightly shorter stroke. slightly higher revving.

Edited July 1, 2017 by boilerdude