Scavenge pump location

[Maggotbreath]

7 hours ago, Gixer1460 said:

This is mine - quite small but sufficient! That is an M10 x 50 screw that got modified to pick up on the pump drive and mate with the M8 cap screw holding the ign. rotor

I also run one of these, got approx 50,000km on it.

[luke2152]

Does the Emtes pump come with the pictured hardware as a sort of diy universal kit?  Or a bike specific bolt on?  Any idea on price

[Tombola]

Depends on the motor, I have a 17.5hp with a thrown rod which is pressure lubricated. 

[bruteforce]

Crank-end pump such as Emtes example didn't work for my bike- turbo too low as they hardly self-prime. I used the Facet electric pump in the end, bought two to also have a spare. Never needed it. You can place it anywhere as it self-primes. You will need a catchtank under the turbo as a fair amount of oil drips from it after shutdown, with the risk of overflowing the turbo.I made a vent on my tank so this can't happen.

 

Edited September 1, 2016 by bruteforce

[El Gringo]

If I could jump in on this thread too please, 

What PSI rating are people using on the facet pumps? 

Looks like Bruteforce is using the 7-10 psi one from the part number but could you use a lower 4-6psi one?

Cheers

[bruteforce]

Pressure is not an issue as the oil gets pumped back into the crankcase, and the flow is also not very large. It needs to be able to withstand the heat of the turbo oil as a first priority.

[Tombola]

These facet solid state pumps how do they work? And not saying yours doesn't work, but how does it handle the heat?

Edited September 1, 2016 by Tombola

[Paulm]

Mines had the same a Facet pump on for 3 years with no issues up to now.

[Tombola]

Ordered one, I want a electric one as I've got a 12v delay off timer to fit to stop the smoke on start up. £2 delivered?! 

[Paulm]

I just permanent live wired my through a switch and leave it on for a few seconds when I switch the ignition off,also fuel pump is wired through the kill switch so it goes off when the kill switch does,that way you can have the ignition on without the fuel pump running if you need to.

[Tombola]

5 hours ago, Paulm said:

I just permanent live wired my through a switch and leave it on for a few seconds when I switch the ignition off,also fuel pump is wired through the kill switch so it goes off when the kill switch does,that way you can have the ignition on without the fuel pump running if you need to.

I'm not that disciplined to do that unfortunately

[Paulm]

39 minutes ago, Tombola said:

I'm not that disciplined to do that unfortunately

You'll only do it a couple of times before you start remembering! Lol

[Tombola]

1 hour ago, Paulm said:

You'll only do it a couple of times before you start remembering! Lol

I say that to myself when I leave my lunch/keys/wallet/phone behind when I go to work lol

[Tombola]

7 hours ago, Paulm said:

I just permanent live wired my through a switch and leave it on for a few seconds when I switch the ignition off,also fuel pump is wired through the kill switch so it goes off when the kill switch does,that way you can have the ignition on without the fuel pump running if you need to.

Do you need to turn the fuel pump off? If you have a malpassi regulator doesn't it just take it back to the tank? 

[Paulm]

Yes it does take it back to the tank,but you can't ever have just the ignition on to check anything without the pump running and it's keeping the floats pressurised with fuel all the time the ignition is on,I just think it's better this way,the pump,is running unnecessarily,same with the scavenge pump if it's on the ignition switch.

[Godzilla]

gave that facet a try, died after about 500 mls. quite sure it can`t handle oil-temperature. though i've got another one in spare i won't stick with it, but convert to mechanical one.

[Gixer1460]

On 9/2/2016 at 11:50 PM, Paulm said:

Yes it does take it back to the tank,but you can't ever have just the ignition on to check anything without the pump running and it's keeping the floats pressurised with fuel all the time the ignition is on,I just think it's better this way,the pump,is running unnecessarily,same with the scavenge pump if it's on the ignition switch.

That's easily cured by wiring the fuel pump relay via the oil pressure switch. Float bowls retain fuel for starting and pump will kick in after a couple of turns of the crank - especially on an oil boiler. Or just put the fuel pump on a separate switch?

[slingy1157]

I wired mine through 2 relays. One gounded by the oil pressure switch ( using the normally closed contact), and one powered off the starter relay (using the normally open contact in parallel with the above normally closed contact) so the pump would run when the engine was cranking to assist with priming etc and then when the engine was running due to the oil light going out. Worked well and meant as soon as the engine was stopped the pumo stopped so no noisy pump running and could have ignition on for testing stuff etc. Plus in the event of a crash it woukd stop the puml as well. I have a diagram i can post if intersted 

[MeanBean49]

Facet pump under the sump on mine too. Been fine for last 2 years.

Cant see why oil temp would be a problem given that oil temp is well below what pumps rated at. Think oil will break down before its too hot for pump

[Godzilla]

1 hour ago, MeanBean49 said:

 

Cant see why oil temp would be a problem given that oil temp is well below what pumps rated at. Think oil will break down before its too hot for pump

facet pump is rated for a maximum off 55 degree celsius, 130 fahrenheit. so, i definitly can see an issue as oil exceeds this value twice under fire.

http://facetpumpen.com/product_info.php?info=p3_facet-kraftstoffpumpe-model-480532.html

facet faq: http://www.facet-purolator.com/faq.php

is a little bit more optimistic but to me still too low for secure use.

Edited September 9, 2016 by Godzilla

[MeanBean49]

Got celsius and farenheut muddled.

However 82 degrees is about what engine oil runs at.

Given that mine has been fine for 2 years and tons of people also been running them for years still camt see a problem

I do speed trials, track days and loads of road riding, pump has been cock on.

Its even melted where it came loose and sat on exhaust pipe and still works.

[Godzilla]

well, though i'm running two really big oil-coolers, my oil easiely reaches 120-130 degrees (cesius) on hot days when kicking it in the ass. temps are measured via an calibrated internal sensor, not one of these housing-gauges. when this hot oil flows into a turbo, which runs at some hundred degrees, it's temperature is easiely twice as high as maximum allowed temperature of the facet pump.

if the pump works for you (and other guys), it's really fine. but mine died suddenly - and that suprises me not, cause running way out of specs. and i think it's important tu share this information.

we've attached the pump to another bike, not running yet, cause not 100% finished. I'll see pretty soon if this pump will survive. i'm quite sure it will die as soon as the other one did.

[MeanBean49]

Strange as oil breaks down at that temperature. Somthing doesnt sound right there.

Should be a good constant 80-90 degrees

[Captain Chaos]

good semi-synthetic oils can handle up to 140 degrees without problems.

[MeanBean49]

No it doesnt. Petroleum based oil starts to break down around 115-120 degrees and thats when its new. I wouldnt want to be running any semi synth above the maximum 100 degrees there designed to work at. Performance drops off rapidly after that.