1052/1127 differences

[davecara]

I’ve had a mooch through the archives and can’t really find anything definitive;

Whats interchangeable between the two 1100 engines? 

I’m currently mooching and swapping to get bits to put a turbo engine together, I’ve got 1127 barrels and busa pistons and another member in here has gifted me a load of bits and bobs but I don’t want to jump into a building the engine without knowing what’ll work and what won’t! 

Will an 1127 crank go into 1052 cases or 750 cases for that matter? Would I need to match the clutch baskets to whatever crank I use? 

I know I’m best finding a complete 1127 to rebuild but I haven’t got 500 quid kicking about! 

[dupersunc]

1127 and 1052 cranks have different size mains.  Primary gears are different, starter motor and sprags are different too. 

I believe barrels and piston are interchangeable and everything above.

[Pasis]

Mains size same. Different strock,  size of pistons, primary gears, clutch some gears, starter clutch, starter and some parts... 1127 crank not go to 750 85-87 and 90-91. May be possible to 750 88-89

with 750 case will be many problems

[clivegto]

1127 barrels should fit 1052 but you have to open the crank case mouths for b12 barrels. It can be done with a dremal type thing if your are careful & don't hit a oil gallery.

[no class]

2 minutes ago, clivegto said:

1127 barrels should fit 1052 but you have to open the crank case mouths for b12 barrels. It can be done with a dremal type thing if your are careful & don't hit a oil gallery.

1127 barrels to 1052 cases will need boring as well.

[davecara]

Are all the heads interchangeable too? 

So far I’m looking at a set of 1127 barrels rebored to suit my pistons; then either build up a bitsa 1127 bottom end or use my 1052 engine

[clivegto]

23 minutes ago, davecara said:

Are all the heads interchangeable too? 

 

750k 1052 1127 & b12 all interchangeable just use the cam sprockets that match the crank. Apart from the 1127m shim head will fit but you need the m cams as well.

Edited December 29, 2017 by clivegto

[no class]

49 minutes ago, davecara said:

 

So far I’m looking at a set of 1127 barrels rebored to suit my pistons; then either build up a bitsa 1127 bottom end or use my 1052 engine

If you go the 1052 bottom end route..... either way the case needs boring to fit the cylinders. I would source a b12 block as it will be better than the 1127 for larger bore . 

[davecara]

50 minutes ago, no class said:

If you go the 1052 bottom end route..... either way the case needs boring to fit the cylinders. I would source a b12 block as it will be better than the 1127 for larger bore . 

I would prefer not to pull my 1052 to bits to be honest but it comes down to pennies at the end of the day!

I've rather foolishly set myself a bit of a challenge to see how cheaply I can stick a turbo motor together!! I've got the run of a decent machine shop and loads of bits to trade/swap so I'll see what I can find. Got 1127 barrels, turbo headers and busa pistons and a load of other odds and sods off a mate, there may be an 1127 bottom end coming my way too that needs a rebuild so fingers crossed if I can get that I'll keep the 1052 in one piece Then it'll just be shells and gaskets to pay proper money for!

[clivegto]

2 hours ago, davecara said:

Then it'll just be shells and gaskets to pay proper money for!

Have you seen the price of shells mate they're not cheap.

[davecara]

1 hour ago, clivegto said:

Have you seen the price of shells mate they're not cheap.

I know that’s why I’m trying to get all the bits on the cheap

Hopefully there’s an 1127 bottom end going that I can trade bits for and I’ll just give that a refresh. Fingers crossed all the bearings will be within spec 

[bruteforce]

I've built a 1052 into a 1195cc turbo engine using 1127 barrels and Mk1 busa pistons. And I've learnt my lessons. All over the internet there's bullsh*t about all the 1100 engines being the same and everything is interchangeable, and fitting busa pistons will land your CR right where you want it for a turbo. Ofcourse not.

It's true you need to dremel the crankcase mouths out to get the 1127 barrels to fit. It is a bitchin work but do-able if you get the right tools (a good milling tool) and because of all the aluminum shards it is advisable to completely disassemble the engine and rinse thoroughly. Then there's the short stroke of the 1052. This not only means that the displacement with busa pistons is not 1216 but 1195cc, but also that the CR will be very very low like 7:1. So you need to skim the head by about 0.7-1mm (measure deck height first!) to get the CR at 8.5-9 : 1.

I use the standard 1052 head with lapped valves, new valvesprings and all is well. It is supposedly the strongest 1100 turbo engine you can get due to the short stroke. It also has coil clutchsprings so a "normal" lockup can be used.

If I'd do it all again (and wouldn't have 3 1052s in spares) I'd probably be easier to get an 1127 as the CR is more or less OK in one go with busa pistons. You'll still need to skim the head for best results though.

 

Oh.... And I've tried to turbo the standard 1052 by fitting a spacer under the block to reduce CR. I broke 3 out of 4 piston ringlands trying to get above 0,5bar.... So not worth a try really. However it is possible to buy good turbo pistons for the 1052 barrels and get something like 1109cc. Ask Minxy.

 

Edited January 2, 2018 by bruteforce