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rider384

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Everything posted by rider384

  1. Thanks for the advice and build threads guys! Definitely gives me some ideas to play with. Need to get the engine built and back in the bike and get my hands on an Eaton unit so I can start fabricating. The plan is to fit an intercooler between the turbos and the supercharger with a Florida-sized injection of meth after the supercharger. I would like to fit an intercooler after the S/C but space is already severely limited everywhere on this bike, I don't know if it would be feasible.
  2. Hi all, looking for any information on whether or not anyone has mounted an Eaton M45/M62 unit to their oil boiler and what the setup looks like. Mainly wondering about the physical placement of the unit - engine is currently out of my bike so I can't easily take any measurements. Also wondering about how the supercharger would be driven off of an oil boiler's engine. Ultimate goal is a sequentially twin charged engine (twin K04s feeding into an M45/M62) with a goal of 400-450whp. The bike as it sits will probably make it to 350whp on the turbos alone, but needs an extra bit of help for that last 100whp. The current TT setup works very well (so well it lifted the head on a 30psi boost spike), but I'm bored and want to mess with a supercharger. I'm a full time student so an S&R blower is cost prohibitive. Mainly looking at using an M62 because they're insanely cheap, especially since I'm in America and the junkyards are full of them.
  3. Hi all, small update. Started pulling the engine apart and saw nothing obvious that would lead to such an extreme loss of compression. I've attached a picture of the piston from the cylinder that was only making 30psi. Apart from some scoring on the top land, I don't see anything extreme. Ringlands are intact and un-cracked or scored. The head gasket was visually in one piece. Top end looks pristine, no scoring on the cam journal bearings or the cam itself. The rings themselves looked fine as well. Two of the piston pins were a pain in the ass to get out, but I assume that's fairly normal for an engine with 32k miles, 5k of which were at 13psi of boost. Anyone have any thoughts? Maybe the cylinder studs stretched and weren't sealing the head properly? Like I said it was a bone-stock unopened 1999 Bandit 1200 engine. I honestly have no idea. Suggestions on next steps? Already planning on taking the head to a machine shop and having them test it and clean it up a bit. Edit: Oh, and the compression gauge was verified and the test was repeated 4 times, each time with the same results, even with some oil down the cylinders
  4. Thanks for the help guys! I'll look into having my pistons machined to lower CR rather than using a base plate spacer, along with going with an MLS head gasket. Thanks for the insight on the piston -> wall clearance, now I have something to tell the machine shop. I'll drop off a piston to work with just for safety's sake. Good to know about the squish clearance, and good to know about machining the pistons down. I've already decided on going 8.5:1 on the compression since I'll be running California, but wasn't sure what the best way of reaching that CR was. I know I'll have to calculate my CR for myself since different manufacturers rate their CR with different conditions - some with gaskets, some without, some theoretical, etc. Thanks for the insights on dishing pistons! When it comes to the rods, I know they're a risk, but I know of several people running their rods and pushing high numbers - not in the 1157 world, but the BMW world. I trust their products, the two K04-015s I'm running are maxpeedingrods brand and I haven't had any issues, I've also run them in my cars in the past with no issues. We'll see about the rods tho. As far as my means/understanding goes, where would the fun in life be if we always stayed within our capabilities? People said the same thing when I built my first turbo kit, then they said the same thing when I LS swapped my E31, and now I hear it about building an engine. Plus, if it blows up, it's an excuse to learn even more when I build the next engine. Thank you! I'll order the parts then, I was waiting on confirmation that they're indeed what I was after. I'm assuming the nitrous guys go with 40-50 thousandths to account for the extra heat and expansion of the piston/rings? I'll probably go towards the upper end for the sake of safety, I'll do a bit more research on it. Luckily I'm already running EFI by way of GSXR throttle bodies and a microsquirt, which I did specifically to gain control of the spark. I believe it is capable of controlling boost as well, but I'll have to look into that. Worst case I get a standalone boost controller. Thanks for the heads up on the washers, I'll add those to my order as well. Good to know. Luckily I didn't pay for the copper one, it came with my pistons. I'll order up an MLS one instead as you and Fredrik have recommended. Thanks guys, outstanding information to work with, I appreciate all of you.
  5. My bone stock 1157 motor finally bit the dust after my wastegate signal line popped off and it briefly saw 30+ pounds of boost from my twin K04 setup. Compression is currently 50-30-80-90. Luckily, this is an excuse to build an engine, but I have zero experience doing that. I have a workshop manual and friends who are more experienced/smarter than I am, so I'm not too worried about the actual physical assembly of the block, but more about the parts I'm going with, primarily whether or not I'm missing anything important. Bear in mind, the goal of this build is 400whp. Parts I have MTC 10:1 81mm Turbo Pistons (MTC-R1216T) Tool Steel Wrist Pins Maxpeedingrods H-Beam Rods (supposedly good for 600-800hp) Cometic 0.032" Copper Head Gasket C8191 Parts I am unsure about and need help with: Cylinder Studs: CS1127GSX - unsure of whether these will fit the Bandit 1200 block I've got, as it's listed as compatible with '86-'92 1127 blocks, but I believe the Bandit 1200 is an 1127 case, correct? Main Bearing Studs: MBS1100GSX - same note as above Head Nuts: CHN1000K or CHN10125-12, again unsure of which ones are correct. I believe it's the CHN1000K, but I just want to be sure. And of course the standard engine rebuild stuff such as gaskets, bearings, o-rings, etc. I'm not going to list it all, just after the big stuff. And for my very basic questions: What diameter base gasket do I need? The smallest diameter available is ~85mm, I guess it's the diameter of the sleeve? What sleeve is in the 1157 Bandit motor stock? I don't have the engine apart yet to measure for myself. How is compression generally lowered in the oil-cooled community? Is it by raising the head, or by raising the jugs? I've found both being presented as solutions. And, if a spacer is used, does it require 2 gaskets? Cylinder Jug Boring - what specification is used as the diameter to bore to? Is it just as simple as 81mm? People talk about 2mm over, but I'm unsure if that literally translates to a bore of 81mm for the jugs or something slightly different More questions to come I'm sure, but I'd like to start off with this as I'd like to start ordering the final parts and hit a machine shop. Any help and advice is appreciated! I've attached a picture of the bike in question just for fun.
  6. Thanks for the words everyone, especially Gixer1460! I ordered up some MTC 1216 10:1 pistons with upgraded tool steel wrist pins, part #MTC-R1216T Going to do my best to track down some sort of head spacer to drop the compression down to 8.5:1 to be a little safer and find someone to bore out my jugs (heh).
  7. Phenomenal information as always Gixer1460, thanks for taking the time! Clears a lot of things up
  8. Is it possible to bore the cylinders out that much on a stock B12 block? I remember reading something about a "big block", but from what I can gather the Blandit 1200 engine is the big block. Going bigger would definitely help reach the goal. Also, unrelated to that, the B12 block is a 59mm crank, correct?
  9. My only worry with that is whether or not the turbo pistons/high comp pistons are different in terms of design - how it spreads the load, how it handles boost (regardless of compression ratio). As I said, I know almost nothing about piston design so I'm hoping someone who's gone down the fully built engine road can chime in. Holeshot makes an 11:1 piston kit for the 1157, but that's about it as far as I can tell. It's so little work to fit Hayabusa pistons (bore the cylinder jugs 2mm over) that no one really makes bespoke Bandit pistons. I'm just struggling to find information on how to make the compression difference work.
  10. Started ordering parts for my 1157 engine build, shooting for 400+ to the wheel. Have a set of h-beam conrods on order right now, trying to work out which Hayabusa pistons to go with but I'm confused on compression numbers. From what I understand, stock Hayabusa pistons in an 1157/stock crank/stock rod length will net around 8.5:1 compression, which is perfect for boost, but I'm looking to go beyond the capabilities of stock Hayabusa pistons. All forged pistons for the Hayabusa seem to be either high compression (13:1ish) or low compression (8.5:1ish), neither of which would land at an ideal compression for a turbo 1216. Never built an engine before, I don't understand much about metallurgy or piston design so forgive the amateurish questions: Am I even on the right track thinking that 8.5:1 Hayabusa pistons in an 1157 would net an insanely low compression ratio, due to the drop in compression ratio with stock Hayabusa 11:1 pistons? IE Stock 11:1 Hayabusa pistons in an 1157 nets ~8.5:1, therefor 8.5:1 Hayabusa pistons in an 1157 would net ~6.5:1? Or am I oversimplifying it? Between the JE, Wiseco, and Carrillo pistons, which are generally regarded as having the highest power capabilities? Alternatively, which are the best value for the money? What part of the 1157 could be shaved off to raise compression, assuming I get the 8.5:1 Hayabusa pistons? Alternatively, as I understand there's some head that bolts on to the 1157 that raises compression ratio about 1.5 points due to a smaller chamber, is this correct? I understand I'll have to mathematically work out what specifically will need to happen with my engine to get my specific build where I want it in terms of compression, I just want to make sure that I'm on the right track before ordering pistons, lest I end up with something completely unusable. Thanks
  11. I ordered them straight from their website, maxpeedingrods.com There was also a couple sets available on Eblag (USA) a couple days ago, but they were about $30 more than what I paid on their website. If you order from the website the coupon code "SUB13" saved me $20.
  12. Thanks for the advice guys! I think say what now!? hit the nail on the head, I was confused because of the different bearing size offerings from Suzuki. Clive, I went with APR2000 bolts. I know those were popular in the Miata community, are they acceptable at higher RPM and load? I ended up ordering the Maxpeedingrods after reading a couple good reviews and seeing people make some big power with them.
  13. Hi all, getting tired of ~220ish whp on a stock engine and would like to build my engine for 400+. Not to be useable, but because I want to. As far as I understand, I'll be well past the limits of the stock rods so upgrades are in order. What I'm primarily wondering about are the differences between all the 1157 engines that came in Bandits - the brand I'm looking at is Maxspeedingrods, because they're cheap, but they list them as being for '96-'98 Bandit 1200s and '93-'98 GSX-R1100s. I know someone I trust who is running them on a 2000 model year, but I just want to confirm that, at least in theory, they'll work. Here's the specs straight from the manufacturer: "Dimensions: Center to center length: 117mm; Big end diameter: 41mm; Small end diameter: 20.02mm ( tapered small end); Big end width: 21mm; Small end width: 21mm" I am worried about the big end diameter - from what I've found online, there are 3 different sizes that came in 1157 engines, but I can't find what those sizes are. Can anyone confirm and tell me which diameters came in which engines/years?/ I would like to avoid Hayabusa rods as that's a much more expensive (albeit proven) route. I have fixed, turbo'd, and fuel injected this bike for less than $2,500usd including the cost of the bike - it's an experiment in cheapness, I'm not looking to debate the efficacy of cheap parts or the risks associated with them. Thanks
  14. Sourced some Fuel Injector Clinic 625cc injectors for an SRT-4 that slipped right in with some different o-rings and a small spacer in the fuel rail mount. Easy sub 1 hour installation, even with swapping the injector pigtails out. I also took the opportunity to lower the base fuel pressure from 3.5bar to 3bar, since I now have more than enough injector to run up to the limits of the stock engine. Bike idles beautifully on all 4 cylinders, albeit very rich, even with the change in injector size accounted for in the fuel constant. Hopefully I'm just down to tuning at this point.
  15. Ok, took it for a quick ride, going to compile some information here: Charging system was bad, has been fixed When the Microsquirt is set on semi-sequential mode, only cylinders 2 and 4 fire. Doesn't matter if it's 1 squirt/simultaneous or 2/alternating, only cylinders 2 and 4 fire. After running on semi-sequential mode and turning the bike off for a couple seconds, it will actually run on all 4 with the fuel pump turned off, presumably from all the fuel vapor hanging around in the intake. The bike fires on all cylinders when set to untimed batch injection, but it starts on two cylinders, runs on 4 after a couple seconds of idling, then goes back to running on 2 when the RPMs go up or load is placed on the bike. Presumably running 2 and 4 normally, and 1 and 3 running off fumes in the intake from ill-timed injection. All 4 spark plugs are firing, 1 and 4 together, and 2 and 3 together I speculate that something is off with the fuel injection timing/my wiring. I currently have cylinders 1-4 and 2-3 wired together for both fuel and spark, which I now speculate to be causing the fuel injection timing to be off by 180* on two of the cylinders. Should I have cylinders 1-3 and 2-4 wired together for the fuel injectors, and 1-4 and 2-3 for the spark? Do I have something backwards? Edit: From what I've found online it really doesn't matter if injection timing is 180* off, so that idea is out the window. I'm going to swap the fuel injectors around and see if the running cylinders follow them. Edit2: Running cylinders followed the injectors! Guessing I didn't clean the fuel rail well enough after I extended it and it clogged 2 of the injectors. Going to order a set tonight with express shipping, can't wait to get them in and get a good run out of this thing.
  16. I think the way I'm wired is messing with the MS voltage readings; log readings are consistently lower than a multimeter on the battery. I'm feeding the MS and pump out of the same fusebox, I'm going to take the fuel pump off and put it on it's own separate circuit and see what happens. Reason I bring this up is because my voltage readings with a multimeter are fine, but voltage while actually running and functioning I report from the datalogs. Regardless, battery is charging up right now, I'll report back with what I find when it's fully charged and running. Independent of this and on to tune stuff: With 1 squirt per cycle and semi-sequential fueling, I'm only running on cylinders 2 and 4. Odd, as the bike fires 1-4 and 2-3 (unless I'm mistaken). I have cylinders 1-4 and 2-3 wired together for both fuel and spark, at least in theory. Wondering if I mixed up two of the spark plug leads when I did the LS coil conversion or fucked up some of the fuel injector wiring. Regardless, I feel like I'm making progress for the first time since I posted this thread. Edit: Am I an idiot? Should I have 1-3 and 2-4 wired together for the injectors? I think I'm 180 out on the fuel injection timing on the cylinders that aren't firing.
  17. Good news today folks: Fixed the second alternator! Popped the back open and one of the solder joints was loose. Re-soldered it and I'm putting out 13.5v at around 3,000RPM. Clamp ammeter showed that the alternator is putting out 11 amps at idle, and 25amps at just off idle. Power consumption is around 13 amps at idle, 14 at just off-idle. All is now well in my charging system, and I'll have a spare alternator lying around when the new one arrives. However, the thing still can't get out of its own way, but at least it's not dropping cylinders anymore. My focus is now moving to the tune. Per an example of an oil-cooled MS tune I got from Arttu, changed from 2 squirts/cycle untimed to 1 squirt/cycle semi-sequential. It runs, but I had to increase the idle screw and change my idle VE from 22 to 60 to get a reasonable AFR. Gonna keep playing with the tune and report back. Thanks for all the charging system advice everyone, one piece of the puzzle is now solved.
  18. Based on the wiring diagrams I've looked at, Gixer1460 is correct. I've checked the wiring a couple times over, there's zero resistance between the alternator leads and the battery, and visibly it all looks fine. I've got a clamp type ammeter arriving later today thanks to Arttu's advice, going to check out my exact draws and alternator outputs when running, see if I've got a short causing massive draw on the system when running or something of the sort.
  19. Updates: Tossed a lithium battery in. Made zero difference. Datalog showed 12.3v with all accessories on but bike off, 12.5-12.6v running, 13v @ 4,500rpm, 12.4v running at the end of the run. I measured 13.2v at the battery with all accessories and the bike fully off at the end of the run. Ordered a third alternator last night. Tested the alternator hooked directly up to the battery, no change. Checked all alternator wiring, it's fine. Can anyone tell me what I should expect it to read with EFI accessories at idle, off idle, and 5,000rpm? Workshop manual says 13.5v, but I don't know if I should realistically expect that with all the EFI stuff on it as well.
  20. The alternator is run through stock wiring. I tested the resistance of the alternator connector to battery and it was negligible. I agree that it doesn't seem to be delivering charging voltage. I know it's doing something because voltage goes up when I rev it, but not nearly as much as I've been lead to believe it should. I'm seeing 13v max at high RPM, and that's with a freshly charged battery. Anything less than a fully charged battery and it'll only go 0.2-0.3v above the voltage with accessories on. I'll try wiring the alternator directly to the battery and see what happens. Maybe there's a power leech somewhere in the circuit that doesn't affect resistance.
  21. Fully charged the battery with my charger and re-tested everything today. Full charge - 13.0v Accessories on - 12.0v Bike idling - 12.5v After a very short ride Battery - 12.5v Accessories on - 11.8v Idling - 12.2v Took some datalogs as well. I can see that the alternator is doing something, but not very much. It always seems to be trailing behind the battery voltage. IE on a fully charged battery, it will put out 13v, but the system voltage doesn't stay there for long, just keeps getting less and less. Final datalog tonight showed the system voltage dipping down into the 11.9v range while running. I think the battery is shot and possibly the alternator I just put in as well. I'm going to throw a lithium battery at it and see what happens. If that doesn't work, it's another new alternator. If that still doesn't work, I'm going to light the bike on fire in my driveway. Built this thing 6 months ago and I haven't gotten a solid pull out of it yet, getting towards the end of my patience with it.
  22. Thanks for the responses guys. I'm going to check the amp draw at idle and see if my accessories are pulling too much power. If so, I'll lower my base fuel pressure and see what else I can trim off. I think I'll remove the stock battery and hook up a known good car battery to it and check the voltage when running. I think Gixer1460 said is spot on - feeding a bad battery voltage is like feeding a prisoner after they've had a lethal injection. Wondering if the battery is bad enough that it can't take a real charge - even when I hook it up to my charger and give it full charge, it drops down to 12.5v after being disconnected for about a minute. At least I can potentially knock the battery off my list of suspects that way.
  23. Updates: Put a new (used) alternator in. Battery reading 12.5v with everything off, 11.9 with all accessories on, and 12.4 with the bike running at idle to low RPM. Can anyone confirm if that seems right? It seems low to me. Wondering if the alternator is better than the old one but still junk. I've tested the alternator wiring, there's negligible resistance between the alternator and the battery. Bike ran ok earlier today; I got higher in the rev range and more throttle before it dropped cylinders. Shut it down for a couple hours, accidentally left one of the gauges on so the battery drained a bit, checked it and it was still at 12.5v, but it ran as poorly as it did before, maybe even worse. Quick summary of what I've tested tonight: Battery voltage off/accessories on/running: 12.5v, 11.9v, 12.4v, respectively Voltage drop between coils and battery. No drop at all Checked for fuel line restrictions and fuel pressure - proper set pressure (50psi) and no kinks in line All cylinders firing, though cylinder 3 takes a while to fire after startup (5ish seconds of dead time until it starts firing) Plan going forward, in order, each subsequent one being done only if the previous one doesn't work: Alternator charging circuit output mod New battery New alternator again Burn the bike to the ground Anyone have any thoughts? I have a suspicion that the battery can't handle the power output of running all the accessories that I've added, and/or the second alternator I just put in is junk, or that something is wrong with the charging circuit itself, but if I do all of those and it's still not running right I really have no idea where to look.
  24. Good idea with the spare cover, thank you. Already found TDC and marked it with an m14x1.25 bolt, that's how I found I was so far off. Once I have the alternator replaced I'll double check timing at higher RPM. If by fit a wheel to the crank you mean a trigger wheel, I'm already running a 24-2. Battery voltage actually dropped significantly when it was running. Definitely the alternator.
  25. Not sure if I tested this correctly, but the alternator with no load was putting out 0.2v at idle and around 3v at higher RPM. Assuming the alternator doesn't need a load on it to be tested correctly, it's definitely the problem.
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